Announcement Announcement Module
Collapse
No announcement yet.
new product? Page Title Module
Move Remove Collapse
X
Conversation Detail Module
Collapse
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • new product?

    new but unsure of name like pro press but no tools required just insert pipe and fitting is locked with no compression required

  • #2
    bert396, sounds like you're talking about the watts "sharkbite" fittings. these are currantly available in 1/2'' and 3/4''. they were suppose to come out in 1'' but have yet too. they are mase of brass with a o-ring seal and stainless gripper teeth. they can be removed with a special release tool. the fittings are approx. $3-5 each and the release tool is under a dollar.

    do a google search for "watts sharkbite".


    rick.

    Comment


    • #3
      You might also be interested in www.nventsolutions.com which offers a similar product for sizes 1/2" and above up to 2".

      [ 12-24-2005, 04:22 PM: Message edited by: WaterBoozer ]

      Comment


      • #4
        very interesting. looked over this site and tried to find a distributor. all seem like east coast. couldn't get into system to check into it further.
        unlike the sharkbite fittings, these do not come apart. they also go up to 2''. i will look into this after the holidays.

        thanks rick.

        Comment


        • #5
          Yes this new fitting by Victaulic looks like it will be a big help for do it yourselfers and untrained start ups. In My Humble Opinion however its still too many o-rings to stack up inside of closed walls and ceilings.

          I respect that others have varying opinions regarding o-ring fittings in enclosed spaces, and while using a few for a tie in with low down time or for a repair might be acceptable, it just seems like a bad idea to install so many o-rings when there is no water present and no down time considerations.
          Work hard, Play hard, Sleep easy.

          Comment


          • #6
            i have not used victaulic pipe mutch but the o-ring is the same type rubber they've used for a long time and it worked this long then it might just work?
            Charlie

            My seek the peek fundraiser page
            http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


            http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

            new work pictures 12/09
            http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

            Comment


            • #7
              HVAC Hawk,

              The seals used in Victaulic pipe have a much larger surface contacting the pipe and making the seal. Also the victaulic systems are not designed for smaller pipe inside a plumbing wall where you may have 25 or 30 fittings within a 10ft section of a plumbing chase. In fact most victaulic, not all but most, are used on fire lines where the liquid inside(when there is liquid at all) is almost always static and the expansion and contraction rate is a slow steady change. The o'rings on all of these newer compression style fittings have a very tiny fraction of an inch sealing against the pipe. Particularly on hot water lines where the constant expansion and contraction at different rates between the seal and the pipe is something I have a real concern with. Even cold water lines in northern climates can have temperature swings of 30 or 40 degrees several times a day in a matter of seconds. Thats a lot of movement and diameter fluctuation. As these o'rings age there is a legitimate concern about seal failure.

              An experienced plumber can still install copper sweat water lines in a large battery of back to back toilet rooms in approximately one day. This will result in a system that is proven millions of times to be able to last for over 50 or 60 years. Properly fit and installed, once the first fitting is heated the next several take very little time at all. Even with the new flux, the increased heat of these newer jet tips make short work of even the larger fittings. Though I agree the new flux causes things to move a little slower than it used to.

              All these new styles of fittings need to be introduced more slowly in order to be time tested before we just toss away good efficient systems that have served us well for a century. MHO
              Work hard, Play hard, Sleep easy.

              Comment


              • #8
                plumber, more and more contractors are using the newer copper vic. especially on larger pipe. even on sump pump discharge lines, where a pressure type pipe is required. i've personally loaned my grooving tool out many times to other contractors.

                i'm not too sure if this new vic. system they are describing is a regular o-ring. it might be a square cut ring or multi ribbed cut ring. i think that a company like vitaulic has too much to lose on a faulty product. the interesting thing about this product is that it's designed not to be taken apart. also the 1/2''- 2'' range is nice to work with.

                the principle behind these types of connections are the same as a mechanical type of joint on hdpe gas piping. this pipe is not always true and round.

                i will call the company to get more literature on this system. pricing will be interesting too.

                rick.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I imagine the weak link in the system will be unskilled laborers installing the system. When this system was designed I'm sure the thought was to have a skilled plumber install a cleaned, square cut,deburred and properly inserted pipe into the new fitting. In reality this new system allows a guy who could care less about the trade assemble the system.

                  Mark
                  "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                  I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Utah,

                    I have done a little more research on these fittings and found that the seal has a small flat area designed to sit against the pipe. While this is an improvement over o-rings I still have a problem with all of these tiny rubber seals inside a closed concrete block wall. And if that flat area gets rolled then what? Your point about bad contractors using poorly skilled men with these easy fittings is another reason to be concerned about this new fitting style. It used to be "any idiot with a "can of glue" and a hack saw".. soon it will be just be "any idiot"...

                    Rick,

                    None of the contractors in this area of Illinois are using copper vic. (though there is a small project a friend of mine will be starting after the first) I have seen victaulic steel on fire lines and pump discharge lines but never on potable water. As far as Nibco caring about their name (which used to mean quality), well, I have seen their name on lavatory faucets made with 100% plastic parts selling for seven dollars. Nibco will put their name on anything if they think they can make 3 pennies, even their fittings are not always trustworthy anymore which is why I always try to use Mueller or Cerro for brass and copper, and Grinnell for iron and steel.

                    If Victaulic is teaming with Nibco and it looks as if they have with this new fitting, then I will start watching Victaulic a little more carefullly in the future. I am not against new ideas and technology but the T-drill was supposed to be better than sliced bread and homogenized milk yet almost every contractor and plumber in my area wants nothing more to do with it.. These new fittings will bear very close scrutiny and I hope Illinois does not allow them in confined or sealed walls for at least 15 years so we can see how they will really hold up in the real world, away from laboratory testing.

                    Speed is good but so is long term quality workmanship and materials, the latter being more important in MHO.
                    Work hard, Play hard, Sleep easy.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      in pa we use victaulic pipe for chilled water,cooling towers . as far as the t drill i have used one for 16yrs and i was the one to ask to buy it. the drill paid for itself on the 1st job i used it on. this was on a heating job in a church and i had to pull a lot of T's. i've only used it on heating systems and as far as i know, you need to braze the joint and not solder it. and ive never had one fitting go bad unless you drop something heavy on it. just my experience.
                      Charlie

                      My seek the peek fundraiser page
                      http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


                      http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

                      new work pictures 12/09
                      http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        hawk,

                        Yeah you have to silver solder the t drill joints. That in itself is no problem. But after prefabbing a long section of pipe it seems unwieldy to move from the fab station or shop to where you are going to hang it. Then putting a long pre fabbed piece that has the stubs out both sides of the pipe up in the clevis or pear hangers is a pain. It looks as though you have figured out a good method for yourself. No one around here cared to keep using it.
                        Work hard, Play hard, Sleep easy.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          i too have used and still own 4 t-drills. we always tried to prefab the tee's, but did'nt braze until it was hung. where we had the room to drill in place, we would hang the pipe and then drill. a prime example is a bathroom flushometer manifold. this way you can put the tee exactly where it will work.

                          i even had to fix a large softner header that was all done on 3'' copper with 1'' pulled tees. they soft soldered it. the only joint to have gone bad was the one they attempted to replace a valve and melted the solder. the amazing thing was that they never notched the pipe or dimpled it. the 1'' branch was installed approx. 1.5'' into the 3'' header.

                          anyone need a t-drill. i can spare a few $$$.

                          rick.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            i just got done with a floor heating header and if i had to use the header from wearsbo it would cost about 5 times more for the header. i had 15 loops and it took me about 1 hr to do this. some times i need to put in a tee for a theromaters , this is a 1/2 well and if i need it in a 3" pipe the cost of a 3x3x1/2 tee is not cheep. most of the times i will hange my pipe and mark it where i need to drill my holes and do all of them before i put in my other pipes. the time it takes for me to braze the joint is less time time to clean 3 sides of the tee and cut and clean 3 pipes then solder it and the cost of the tee. the more you do something the faster you can get.
                            Last edited by HVAC HAWK; 01-02-2006, 06:05 PM.
                            Charlie

                            My seek the peek fundraiser page
                            http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


                            http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

                            new work pictures 12/09
                            http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              hvac hawk, i'll second that. it's always a good idea to pre-drill to allow for the shavings to spill out.

                              rick.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X