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  • Hot on the left, cold on the right

    I am roughing in my island kitchen sink, 8" OC, about 2" from the back of the cab so far.

    The question is that since the DW will be on the right of the sink base it would make great sense to put the hot supply on the right side to shorten the distance to the DW and the cold supply would then be on the left side (normally occupied by the hot line).

    I know this is opposite of the norm but is it ever done?

  • #2
    Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

    Answering as a homeowner as I'm certainly not a plumber.... but, I bought a home over a year ago that I am still renovating. The upstairs plumbing was reversed with the hot on the right and the cold on the left. What a pain in the A$$ that was. At first thoughts, it was like "what difference does it make" and "is it worth the cost of a plumber" to have it switched back to normal?

    Well, being on a tight budget the answer was "we can live with it!" But after standing in the shower and instinctly reaching for the right faucet to cool it down a bit... and getting the opposite, it was promptly decided that it needed to be changed at whatever the cost.

    So, seeing that your wife or daughter will probably be the one who is washing the dishes and will most likely feel the effects of this unusual configuration, I am sure you would be better off sticking to "hot on the left and cold on the right".

    For whatever it's worth,

    CWS

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    • #3
      Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

      It's done by people by accident. I have never heard of it being done on purpose and I wouldn't recomment it at all. Not even sure it would pass code if the inspector was wise enough to look for it. They have soft copper for d/w water supplies, if you don't like soft copper, use a stainless braided supply in 3/8" and if it isn't long enough, use a 3/8 compression union and two supplies. It is recommended to use 2 seperate angle stops, one for the d/w and one for the k/s faucet. the same set up is recommended for the ice maker and cold side k/s lines.
      sigpic

      Robert

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      • #4
        Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

        Yeah, depending on how your pipes are set up and what not, chances are you can fix that just by switching the 2 water supply lines to the fixture around.
        Proud To Be Union!!

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        • #5
          Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

          Good advice and that's more or less what I thought. For the record teh faucet would be plumbed correctly, hot and cold so the user would never know the difference. The only difference would be the juxtaposed placement of the pipes in the cabinet, nothing more, and clearly labeled.

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          • #6
            Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

            You can cross the lines under the sink, yes, but the copper comming out of the wall is still wrong. Maybe I didn't understand your original post, what is the reason you want to rough them in backwards? I have no clue as a professional plumber what difference 2' is going to make. What side are you going to put hte air gap and the garbage disposal on? switching the flex under the sink and having the hot come on the right and the cold come on the left is a crap way of doing plumbing.
            Last edited by westcoastplumber; 07-07-2007, 06:52 PM.
            sigpic

            Robert

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            • #7
              Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

              It is not just the person washing the dishes that has to orry about the hot and cold coming from opposite sides. Everyone who ge to that sink, even just to wash their hands will automatically grab the cold side EXPECTING to have cold water coming out.

              My grandmother actually owned an apartment building in Brentwood that had all the hot and cold lines switched in the baathrooms when she bought it. The contractor's brilliant solution was to just swap the "H" and "C" plugs. Rick fixed all the units for her as it was a huge liability.

              Mrs. Seat Down
              phoebe it is

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              • #8
                Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                Originally posted by Aaron91 View Post
                Yeah, depending on how your pipes are set up and what not, chances are you can fix that just by switching the 2 water supply lines to the fixture around.
                Aaron, the problem with allowing the lines to come out crossed and then reversing the flex lines is this: Say you are the plumber in three years that goes out there to change the old supply lines, you don't notice that they are crossed, then you re-install them the right way, not testing them before you leave, thinking you did everything correct (because cold is on the right and hot is on the left on a correct installation) then the next person has the cold on but hot comes out and they get burned? like rick said, it's a liability. Clearely labeled dosen't mean anything, I see tags all the time that wear out. I went to a water heater call at 3am, it was leaking, I turned the gate valve off and the water didn't stop leaking, so assuming it was a broken gate valve, which isn't out of the ordinary, (gates break all the time) I turned the water off to the building and replaced it, new ball valve on the cold side (right side) turned the water on back at the street and the customer came out screaming, (I had pulled the water heater) I turned the water back off, went inside, (I closed my ball valve) problem was, the hot was on the righ and the cold was on the left. remember what I said in other post's, Murphys Law, this is why we do things right in this trade, and putting the hot on the right side and the cold on the left side is the wrong way. look it up in your IPC and see if there is a code section on it........remember, do things the right way Aaron, it's your signature on the work.
                Last edited by westcoastplumber; 07-07-2007, 07:26 PM.
                sigpic

                Robert

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                • #9
                  Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                  Sorry Robert that was me logged into Rick's acct. He will post soon

                  Joey
                  phoebe it is

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                  • #10
                    Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                    No worries joey, I am sure rick will have somewhat of the same opinion.

                    good job! sorry about the loss last night. Do you slick track better??

                    robert
                    sigpic

                    Robert

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                    • #11
                      Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                      OK, OK, dumb idea. The main reason for swapping the supplies in the cab was to put the hot line closer to the DW. As was clearly stated, less than 2' will make no difference so I will rough everything as it should be with no games. I have all the info I need about that and thanks to you all.

                      But, since they have been brought up I certainly could use an education on air gaps. I have never used on nor seen one in use here in central NY. I asked at a local HD and Lowes and I don't think they were too familiar with them or their purpose. I am unsure if local code requires them and will get that answer before I proceed. My research earlier was mixed with some favoring the air gap and some saying that the high loop method is sufficient. I welcome a real world perspective relative to air gaps. I'll need a hole added to the new counter to accompdate the piece if I go that way.

                      Lastly, I am also contemplating a diposal and have NO experience with them either although their installation seems pretty straight forward. If there's anything special I need to know please send that along.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                        nervous, the only reason one would ruff in the water subs backwards is to save money on the extra fittings or extra labor.

                        when i was doing new construction large scale tract work/ apts/ condos. there were some foreman that would reverse the waters on the sinks on a back to back sink installation. this saved lots of material and time as there were waste and vent lines to get around if we had to cross them. they would stub out correctly on 1 side of the wall and stub out reversed on the other side. then they would paint or solder a 1/2'' x 3/4'' ftg. reducer on the stub out to identify the cross for when it was time to set finish.

                        remember this was to save money when we were doing 100- 500 units at a time. there are plenty of single handle tub/ shower valves that also would allow you to reverse the water too. moen was the easiest. others required different cartridges. i was never a fan of this on a back to back. but the instructions and manufactures would show it on their spec sheets if necessary. they even made the reverse cartridges too.

                        once again i didn't care for it. but i wasn't the one writing the checks

                        if it can be ruffed in properly, then do it. if not then swap the feed lines and it's no big deal.

                        interesting question, but not worth all the time and energy in explaining. the time it took to post this was more time than to ruff it in properly

                        rick.
                        phoebe it is

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                        • #13
                          Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                          Originally posted by nervous View Post
                          OK, OK, dumb idea. The main reason for swapping the supplies in the cab was to put the hot line closer to the DW. As was clearly stated, less than 2' will make no difference so I will rough everything as it should be with no games. I have all the info I need about that and thanks to you all.

                          But, since they have been brought up I certainly could use an education on air gaps. I have never used on nor seen one in use here in central NY. I asked at a local HD and Lowes and I don't think they were too familiar with them or their purpose. I am unsure if local code requires them and will get that answer before I proceed. My research earlier was mixed with some favoring the air gap and some saying that the high loop method is sufficient. I welcome a real world perspective relative to air gaps. I'll need a hole added to the new counter to accompdate the piece if I go that way.

                          Lastly, I am also contemplating a diposal and have NO experience with them either although their installation seems pretty straight forward. If there's anything special I need to know please send that along.
                          the air gap is to protect the potable water form a potential cross connection . it forms a physical 1'' air gap between the waste and the fixture. if the sink was to fill up with a stoppage and waste water, a high loop will not prevent waste water from entering the dishwasher. then under the right conditions, the contaminated waste could enter the potable system.

                          most of the newer european machines don't require an air gap. they have a built in backflow protector in the incoming water supply line.

                          disposals are pretty straight forward. make sure you knock out the disposal/ dishwasher plug if you connect it to a dishwasher.

                          rick.
                          phoebe it is

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                            Originally posted by nervous View Post
                            OK, OK, dumb idea. The main reason for swapping the supplies in the cab was to put the hot line closer to the DW. As was clearly stated, less than 2' will make no difference so I will rough everything as it should be with no games. I have all the info I need about that and thanks to you all.

                            But, since they have been brought up I certainly could use an education on air gaps. I have never used on nor seen one in use here in central NY. I asked at a local HD and Lowes and I don't think they were too familiar with them or their purpose. I am unsure if local code requires them and will get that answer before I proceed. My research earlier was mixed with some favoring the air gap and some saying that the high loop method is sufficient. I welcome a real world perspective relative to air gaps. I'll need a hole added to the new counter to accompdate the piece if I go that way.

                            Lastly, I am also contemplating a diposal and have NO experience with them either although their installation seems pretty straight forward. If there's anything special I need to know please send that along.
                            Our code, the UPC requires air gaps as a form of cross connection control, it reduces the chance of dirty water backing up into the dish washer by giving the flow an "air gap" also to allow air into the system, kinda like a vent. I have never seen any problems with the high loop, other then it not being code approved here in los angeles. dependant on your code, install what is required. They are very easy to install. Garbage disposal, not really much to them, I find that my customers like the In-sink-erator pro 333. one thing to watch with this model, they are quiet, so remember to turn it off when your done
                            sigpic

                            Robert

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Hot on the left, cold on the right

                              New York uses the IPC which does not require an air gap but you still need to strap the hose to the under side of the counter top. You also need to install your angle stops in the correct orrientation. (hot on left cold on right)

                              Mark
                              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

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