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  • plumbing design in high rise

    They have a new building that's supposed to be Virginia's tallest building and seeing it got me thinking. How do they keep water pressure up all those floors? Booster pumps? After how many floors would they need one if that's what they do? On the flip side; how do they slow waste water and such when it comes down the stack? A flush should weigh around 13.33 lbs. Flush that down 10 floors and it's got some speed. Never done big vertical project and was curious about it. Thanks

    Ben
    Buy cheap, buy twice.

  • #2
    Re: plumbing design in high rise

    They run one main water line up to the top floor, then pipe all the fixtures in on the way back down using gravity. The other way to do it is use the same principal and install a pump on the main to pump it up to the top, then pipe it down. either way there are no branch lines tied to the main on the way up. hope this help ben
    sigpic

    Robert

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    • #3
      Re: plumbing design in high rise

      makes perfect sense, what about the dwv?
      Buy cheap, buy twice.

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      • #4
        Re: plumbing design in high rise

        they drain it in sections at a time I believe, certain number of floors in a stack, adam will be a great guy to give you the details on this one. thats when yoke vents and such come into play.
        sigpic

        Robert

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        • #5
          Re: plumbing design in high rise

          Storage tanks for the water, strategically located for pressure on floors below it...boosters to get the water there in the first place.
          At .434 psi per foot of height you won't be getting water all the way up the top of a highrise when a street main has 60-100 psi.
          Yolk vents are a secondary vent stack in buildings over ten stories.
          They connect to the regular vent stack every ten stories @ 36" above floor level.

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          • #6
            Re: plumbing design in high rise

            GJ,

            There are way too many methods to give you a blanket answer. One method which has not been mentioned is seperating the floors into zones and then installing pressure regulating stations for each zone.

            Mark
            "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

            I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

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            • #7
              Re: plumbing design in high rise

              the largest building i work on is a 27 story residential condo project. i've been there since the end of construction. the funny part was that we bid on it and didn't get it for the construction.

              so now i service it for the last 17 years.

              the street pressure supplies the first 4 floors with pressure regulators on the cold. then the variable speed booster pumps supply 50 psi to the top of the building for the boilers. the zones are 5-12/ 12-19/ 20-27.

              the hot is fed down from the roof starting off at 50 psi and picking up approx. 1/2# per foot of drop. so there are also hot water regulators and return lines for these zones. the critical issue is to maintain the hot and cold at equal pressure throughout the zones with staged cla-valves.

              originally the building used booster heaters at the zones to maintain the circ. temperature. very expensive to operate and maintain. also large circ pumps to keep it flowing.

              there was also a very large hot water storage tank that i eventually took off line for relining and they never went back. the system is now a continuous hot loop and is maintained by roof top heaters.

              there has been many changes to the system to keep clean water. also the underground ductile iron has been replaced to copper.

              as far as the waste lines. after you have a 10 story building the system has yoke vents and re vents every 5 floors. this keeps the pressure in the line relieved as the waste is falling very fast.

              there were some soap sud issues, but that has been addressed.

              a very qualified building engineer keeps everything fine tuned.

              during my new construction days, we did a 29 story office building and a 13 story hotel. those were the tallest ones i've worked on. i've got the scar to prove it

              rick.
              phoebe it is

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              • #8
                Re: plumbing design in high rise

                Rick, or anybody else want to explain why so many high rises have soap sud issues with there laundrys?

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                • #9
                  Re: plumbing design in high rise

                  Originally posted by TomSV650 View Post
                  Rick, or anybody else want to explain why so many high rises have soap sud issues with there laundrys?
                  it's not just high rise.

                  anytime you have a stacking laundry room, you have the potential of excess soap. typically the bottom floor gets the suds.

                  most of the problem is due to too much soap or additives in the washer.

                  i would say that common sense will eliminate 95% of the problem. also i find it's house keepers and not the owner who does the laundry and creates the problem.

                  i even had an issue with "greg brady" and i spoke to "alice" the house keeper to resolve it.

                  it was really greg brady, but not alice. it just sounded good

                  rick.

                  nowadays the common laundry stacks has to be separated from the rest of the waste fixtures. still if it gets abused, it will back up with soap.
                  phoebe it is

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                  • #10
                    Re: plumbing design in high rise

                    yes high rise design is a specialist field indeed.

                    No one typical method for water supply to upper floors.

                    Not so many large storage tanks used on mid floors here these days.The real estate is just too valuable. Plus engineering issues of large tanks in light weight designs.

                    I dont claim to be an authority by any means,just observe what i install, and listen to designers i know.

                    Anyone dealt with Siphonic Drainage? Laid without fall, and sized smaller than graded drains. Ive only dealt with it on roof drainage.

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                    • #11
                      Re: plumbing design in high rise

                      Originally posted by Australian Plumber Josh View Post
                      Anyone dealt with Siphonic Drainage? Laid without fall, and sized smaller than graded drains. Ive only dealt with it on roof drainage.

                      I'm hoping you'll elaborate...sounds interesting.
                      I imagine they're not good for solid waste though.

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                      • #12
                        Re: plumbing design in high rise

                        Originally posted by TomSV650 View Post
                        Rick, or anybody else want to explain why so many high rises have soap sud issues with there laundrys?
                        Suds vent.
                        On any building with 3 or more vertically consecutive laundries there is an added vent, almost like a smaller version of a yoke vent.

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                        • #13
                          Re: plumbing design in high rise

                          The UPC say's that on a suds producing fixture, once it goes horizontal, the nearest tie in can not be any closer then 8' to reduce the suds that will go back into the standpipe closest to the verticle to horizontal.
                          sigpic

                          Robert

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                          • #14
                            Re: plumbing design in high rise

                            Originally posted by westcoastplumber View Post
                            The UPC say's that on a suds producing fixture, once it goes horizontal, the nearest tie in can not be any closer then 8' to reduce the suds that will go back into the standpipe closest to the verticle to horizontal.
                            NOW we're talkin'!
                            CODE!
                            We're not UPC here, but this is what I was hoping for when I joined.

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                            • #15
                              Re: plumbing design in high rise

                              http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12197


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