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  • #16
    Re: Flood Control Measures

    Oh great Aaron,now you put the 90 on backwards.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Flood Control Measures

      Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
      Aaron, I need a bucket of steam, any idea where I can get one?
      I know where you can get some but I'll need an ID-10-T form first.
      Buy cheap, buy twice.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Flood Control Measures

        Originally posted by gear junkie View Post
        I know where you can get some but I'll need an ID-10-T form first.
        I got my library card

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Flood Control Measures

          Originally posted by JERRYMAC View Post

          For all your information;
          in the "CHICAGO" area the storm water and the sewer system go'es though the same pipe system,

          yes. a backwater will stop the backup from the city;
          but you need a water alarm in basement area, when the city line back's up and you are still running water/sewer upstairs
          this will flow out in the basement!!!
          if it was me and the only downstairs fixtures you can do without i would pull the fixtures and plug the drains!!!
          if you want to use downstairs fixtures then put in some kind of
          water alarm, and moniter it during high rainstorms

          JERRYMAC MASTERPLUMBER & MASTER DRAINMAN


          Thanks for the replies but from what I am reading I think I would elect to cap the toilet and vanity drain and do without, probably knock a wall down and make my workshop bigger (it’s next to it). I can live without a toilet in the basement and it was the only room I could stand up in, if you get my drift.

          I don’t have floor drains but I do have a utility sink, when we flooded and I got home from work eventually through bad traffic there was about 12 inches of water in the basement and rising, trying to get the bolt caps off was a real pain as one side of the toilet was pretty close to the wall and it took me about 10-15 minutes trying to lever off the damn cap with me straddling the overflowing bowl in my swimming trunks with a maglight stuck between my teeth. I then unbolted it and rammed an old pair of workshorts down the hole followed by some bricks and then the toilet. There was a gurgling sound and some gook came into the utility sink but that basically stopped it. The sewer lift station in our neighborhood had lost power (my house included) and it did not have a generator back-up, the city eventually got one online about 6 hours later.

          I have my basement walls now down to the studs four feet high and I was taking a look at the piping in the basement bathroom and from what I can tell, the waste pipe from upstairs that joins up with the toilet hole seems to angle towards the basement family room and that would shoot straight through the garage down to the street. Would they likely have made the pipe to angle out to the yard? Or do they generally go straight? Sorry it’s a strange question and I probably need a plumber to come take a look but I was hoping to arm myself with some knowledge before I take action.

          With capping the toilet as an option, would that cause problems with my foundation and the pressuere of sewer back up? My local councilman seems to think it would, I doubt it myself as it would only happen on rare occasions. Would putting a plug in it or cementing be the better option, I think I would prefer a plug in case when I come to sell the next owner could elect to have a toilet.


          Thanks again for all your help!!

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Flood Control Measures

            Originally posted by Sump Stumped View Post

            With capping the toilet as an option, would that cause problems with my foundation and the pressuere of sewer back up? My local councilman seems to think it would, I doubt it myself as it would only happen on rare occasions. Would putting a plug in it or cementing be the better option, I think I would prefer a plug in case when I come to sell the next owner could elect to have a toilet.


            Thanks again for all your help!!
            glad he's your councilman and not your plumber

            the water / waste coming into your basement is from the sewer line backing up. typical sewer lines when installed are tested to 10' of head/ 5psi.

            i would install an internal expansion plug on the pipe. leave the floor flange there for future re installation. also the sink might need to be capped too if the water has a chance to back up that high.

            also a battery powered water alarm is a good idea. maybe a sump pump to discharge back outside in case of a leak too

            have your councilman sign up here. we need more politics mixed in with the forum

            rick.
            phoebe it is

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Flood Control Measures

              Originally posted by westcoastplumber View Post
              I would suggest installing a telescopic backwater valve where your sewer exits the footing. It has a 6" diameter pipe riser, with either a 4" or a 3" diameter pipe that slides down inside, attached to that is a another fitting with the flapper on it. Very good design. easy to locate in the yard, it has a 6" FIP and a RH plug. the length of the risers depend on the depth of your sewer.

              Like mentioned before to many "plumbers/ drain cleaners" do not look for these devices and I have gone to many that have been broken off or someone has gotten stuck. You as the owner know, when you have a mainline stoppage, tell the plumber/ drain cleaner that you have one on your line. Once a cable is pulled back through it without removing the flapper after the stoppage is cleared, it is worthless.

              The appropriate term for the device is called a Backwater valve, a backwater valve is for sewage or graywater that has objects in it, a check valve is for water only.

              Telescopic is the best way to go, it raises the device above ground, easy to service and maintain. The other place I have located them would be by the crawl space entrance hole, on the main 3" or 4" drain,(this wouldn't be a telescopic) easy access, but not as easy as in the front yard, For looks, put it in a yard box, one that say's "sewer" on the lid.

              I install a 4" mainline c/o after my backwater valves.

              I am unable to find a picture of the one I use, but if you have a plumber go to a local plumbing supply house (not home depot) he will know what to get.
              That appears to be an option as well, but as I said in my last post I'm not even sure where the main pipe exits and I hope it's into the front yard and not through the garage and under the driveway, but after three years in this house nothing would surprise me. 1973 split level custom built home.

              I have a large tree over the road and I need to rod at least once a year, they have to come inside and go through an access through the wall into the waste pipe coming from upstairs. If it would work I would like to go with the option mentioned by WCP but I will have to find out where my line exits.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Flood Control Measures

                Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
                glad he's your councilman and not your plumber

                the water / waste coming into your basement is from the sewer line backing up. typical sewer lines when installed are tested to 10' of head/ 5psi.

                i would install an internal expansion plug on the pipe. leave the floor flange there for future re installation. also the sink might need to be capped too if the water has a chance to back up that high.

                also a battery powered water alarm is a good idea. maybe a sump pump to discharge back outside in case of a leak too

                have your councilman sign up here. we need more politics mixed in with the forum

                rick.
                Thanks for the information, as the whole neighborhood got nailed we have a plumber coming out this Thursday to check into doing all the houses that had basement flooding. I like the idea of West Coast Plumber’s but I’m not sure if that is feasible considering I’m not sure where the line exits. I don’t know where my councilman gets his ideas from but he seemed positively alarmed when I mentioned capping the toilet when I was discussing the length of time it took them to get backup power back on the lift station.

                I have a sump pump fitted, a Ridgid ½ HP with a Basement Watchdog battery back-up and I did have two water alarms, one in the crawl and one next to the toilet, though after the flood I have no idea where they are now. I did try and fit a Ridgid 1 HP with the microswitch but everytime we got heavy rain it would go off quite a lot and the problem was it would suck the water down to the intakes and make this awful gurgling sound. I would have love to have kept it as it certainly kicked the water out fast but I think there was a problem with the water sensing microswitch.

                I had a finished basement and the cost to R&R is currently round about $30,000, so I seriously want to take firm steps so this does not happen again. I am even considering sandbagging the crawl at the two inch ledge as I have had rain so hard the pumps could not keep up. In those cases invariably the streets outside are flooded, I think they made a cock-up as they built new commercial buildings in what was originally part of a catch area for flood water. I have neighbors sitting higher than my house who have lived there for 37 years, never flooded and ended up that night getting three feet in their basement.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Flood Control Measures

                  the pump sound is from pumping too low. the pedestal pump has a simple adjustment to set the upper on and lower off positions. also a check valve on the pump discharge line is critical to keep the water from coming back into the pit.

                  the fact that the whole block was flooded sounds like a city issue and possible lack of back up generators/ maintenance.

                  who is paying for the damages?

                  rick.
                  phoebe it is

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Flood Control Measures

                    Yes, the city were certainly to blame for not having a backup generator on site as we have overhead wires and a tree falling on lines knocked the power off. The water coming up from the toilet was quite something to witness, if there had been back-up power then we would not have been flooded like we were.

                    This was brought up in a recent city meeting and they are placing a permanent back-up generator for the lift station arriving late 2007, early 2008. I will not be redoing the basement until that is in place. As for who is going to pay for all the damage, we are working with our neighbors to find a lawyer who can advise us if we can chase the city for compensation.

                    Our insurance paid some, but not all. There is a move to have the area declared a Federal Disaster Area (it was declared a state disaster area) in order to unlock some funds that way also.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Flood Control Measures

                      [quote=PLUMBER RICK;94707]the pump sound is from pumping too low. the pedestal pump has a simple adjustment to set the upper on and lower off positions. also a check valve on the pump discharge line is critical to keep the water from coming back into the pit.
                      quote]

                      The Ridgid 1 HP pump is not a pedestal, it had a microswitch that sits in a plastic housing that moves up and down a steel rod (not adjustable) and senses water that way. The one I had seemed to sense water a little bit lower than it should causing the air gasping through the intakes. It was a brand new model when I bought it.

                      I am quite happy with my Ridgid ½ horse. Seems to work fine.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Flood Control Measures

                        Forget about what your councilman has to say if he promises to stay out of plumbing i will stay out of politics !!!
                        the worst that could happen from capping the sewer, would be that it would back up to the first floor level, as long as you have good tight capp's on the basement drains the backwater valve will stop the sewer water from the city from backing into your house,

                        A few years ago i had a similar job, the homeowner called to say the
                        whole house was flooding, found that the city sewer had clogged up from a grease blockadge, between the man hole and the main tie-in
                        not more then a couple feet seperation!! because this single family
                        home was above street level, but the street and housing tract clamped steeply up a hill above this house, everthing that was flushed
                        down the city line from up hill it was running out of toilets,tubs, and
                        shower drains flooding house with "RAW SEWAGE" the homeowner was not happy!!! she had me come back snake all the drains in the house
                        to be sure they were cleared, then i installed a code approved backwater valve, To make sure city could never backup into their house again!!
                        JERRYMAC
                        E-MAILJERRYMAC777@GMAIL.COM
                        CALIF. LIC. PLBG,HEAT,DRAINS,ELECTRIC,WATER HEATER, BOILER, POOL AND SPA HEATER
                        FIRE SPRINKLER CONTRACTOR,
                        SINCE JAN. 1989

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Flood Control Measures

                          By the way the homeowner did collect from L. A. city for all damages and cost of restortion of house!!!

                          JERRYMAC
                          JERRYMAC
                          E-MAILJERRYMAC777@GMAIL.COM
                          CALIF. LIC. PLBG,HEAT,DRAINS,ELECTRIC,WATER HEATER, BOILER, POOL AND SPA HEATER
                          FIRE SPRINKLER CONTRACTOR,
                          SINCE JAN. 1989

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Flood Control Measures

                            I am at the end of a hill as well, not steep but a hill none the less. I believe this also contributed to the pressure of the sewage coming into the house. The sanitary line had flood water breaching into it also and iron manhole covers in the street were lifting 4 inches from their seat with the water pressure.

                            Thing is we flooded (not as bad) in October of last year and one of the improvements listed was to set up a permanent generator on the sewage lift station. The city I live in has ten lift stations and four do not have permanent back up generators. Would you belive that the more affluent areas of the town all have stationary back up generators

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Flood Control Measures

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Flood Control Measures

                                Originally posted by Sump Stumped View Post
                                I have a question, my basement flooded with 12 inches of sewage water on a big storm in the Chicagoland region on the 23rd of August. I need to get a backflow valve fitted (not an ejector pump) does the valve go on the outside of the house or is it placed in the pipe in my crawlspace under the foundation in the existing metal pipe?, I have a toilet in my basement. Which leads to my next question, can an outside access be fitted after the valve if they are excavating to place the valve in the clay pipe?

                                Overhead plumbing is way too expensive and does not from what I have heard stop the backup of sewage in a power outtage situation.

                                The other plan is to cap my toilet hole in the basement using a econl plug (spelling?)

                                What would your recommendations be?

                                Check out J S Smith, They have one that is automatic and really does a great job. JR Smith also makes back water valve (Check) and it should be installed AFTER the house trap and accessible.

                                Possibly with with a WYE after the back water valve as it makes snaking a lot easier

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