Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

    We went to check out a sewer leak today on the beach below Convention Hall in Asbury Park NJ
    (Bruce Springsteen made it famous, amongst others)
    tell me how you guys would repair this:
    It is a beautiful Historic building on concrete pilings on the beach almost reaching the ocean
    The underneath of the building is the beach sand - wide open & you can walk & crawl to the exposed sewer & roof drain pipes
    above the sand is a 4' thick concrete floor
    There is a 3" CI pipe broke flush w/ the bottom of the floor
    the bottom of the floor (exposed to salt/moisture) is in pretty bad shape already (after all the building is about 80 yrs old)
    about 8 - old school - 5' floor drain urinals tie into the 3" CI
    (all sewer is somehow tied in in this 4' thick floor)
    The reason I mention its Historic, they try their utmost to do as little demo as possible, as to not cause future ongoing problems
    We do not want to use a chipping hammer to break around pipe as the concrete all around is liable to crumble & who knows what we may run into
    My ONLY thought is to buy a toilet repair flange (4X3 w/ rubber gasket at bottom), cut off closet ring, stick gasket side inside 3" CI & somehow adapt from this to the existing 4" PVC sewer
    what do my McGyver plumbing friends think?
    Attached Files

  • #2
    Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

    As much as you want to please the customer your going to have to do the proper instalation.You have a pretty good idea allready.You have to get topside access and replace the penetration.

    Don't fall asleep on the sand.We used to do a few customs on pylings.Sand,babes,dolphins and....... FLEAS!!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

      Sorry ,I'm not good at hand holding. This not aimed at You.
      The defination of the customer from hell - "I want what I want, but I don't know what I want'
      And when I get it,I won't like it !!!
      I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

        If you and they want to save this historic R&R venue, which I agree it is (saw Bruce at the LA Colusium in about 1984), it sounds like they need more than "jerry rigging". Propose a price to fix it correctly, and walk away if they don't like it.
        the dog

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

          What about using a concrete coring company, grind off the flange and have them use a 4"or 5" core bit centered over the remaining pipe. It gives you a clean hole and no vibration.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

            Originally posted by Pipes
            use a 4"or 5" core bit centered over the remaining pipe.
            I was thinking along the same lines - core drill with a long extension. 4' is a long drill!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

              We will be disassembling old broke sewer this morning
              the problem w/ core drilling is:
              since there are about 8 floor drained urinals above all tying into this 1 - 3" CI coming through the bottom of the 4' floor to underside of exposed building, i would think there are going to be old CI fittings everywhere - traps, y's etc.
              so, if we were to start opening concrete, it may be that we would have to open a LOT of that concrete to find where we could properly transition from CI to plastic
              conceivably, this could entail tearing out all 4' concrete floor underneath all 8 very valuable urinals just to expose enough of the sewer to repair
              this could break up old nice floor/wall tile which there is no replacement etc.
              this will never fly due to the Historic nature & old condition of building
              the owners logically wouldn't jeopardize the integrity of the building for this repair
              i believe we do not have a choice whether to do a proper repair here or not
              we will repair w/ least destruction as possible & make sure there are no leaks
              this area underneath the building is regularly checked for leaks by the maintenace crew due to the homeless regularly squatting there
              if there is a problem in the future, they may have to tear out entire bathroom, at least we tried our hardest to resolve the problem & cause the least damage
              after all this is not a wood framed house where anything can be repaired and replaced - almost all repairs here require a lot of attention
              it is a multimillion dollar Historic building where they spend an enormous amount of money keeping it look exactly as it did 80 yrs. ago - outside & inside

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                Originally posted by ericwagner4 View Post
                We will be disassembling old broke sewer this morning
                the problem w/ core drilling is:
                since there are about 8 floor drained urinals above all tying into this 1 - 3" CI coming through the bottom of the 4' floor to underside of exposed building, i would think there are going to be old CI fittings everywhere - traps, y's etc.
                so, if we were to start opening concrete, it may be that we would have to open a LOT of that concrete to find where we could properly transition from CI to plastic
                conceivably, this could entail tearing out all 4' concrete floor underneath all 8 very valuable urinals just to expose enough of the sewer to repair
                this could break up old nice floor/wall tile which there is no replacement etc.
                this will never fly due to the Historic nature & old condition of building
                the owners logically wouldn't jeopardize the integrity of the building for this repair
                i believe we do not have a choice whether to do a proper repair here or not
                we will repair w/ least destruction as possible & make sure there are no leaks
                this area underneath the building is regularly checked for leaks by the maintenace crew due to the homeless regularly squatting there
                if there is a problem in the future, they may have to tear out entire bathroom, at least we tried our hardest to resolve the problem & cause the least damage
                after all this is not a wood framed house where anything can be repaired and replaced - almost all repairs here require a lot of attention
                it is a multimillion dollar Historic building where they spend an enormous amount of money keeping it look exactly as it did 80 yrs. ago - outside & inside
                So why are you not submitting a proposal for an enormous amount of money to remedy the problem properly.

                I know what your up against,believe me

                What are you looking for us to say

                Adam

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                  Originally posted by drtyhands View Post
                  So why are you not submitting a proposal for an enormous amount of money to remedy the problem properly.

                  I know what your up against,believe me

                  What are you looking for us to say

                  Adam
                  adam
                  i was looking for a better/alternative repair fitting than cutting off a repair flange & using that like i stated in 1st post
                  not only that, the owners give my father 99% of his work & just about pay both of our salaries
                  going to them & telling them the ONLY resolution is to tear out entire 4' concrete floor (possibly condeming entire building as well as the Paramount Theater which is attached), 8 urinals, & who knows what else in a Historic - 1 of a kind building - isnt how we work

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                    Originally posted by ericwagner4 View Post
                    adam
                    i was looking for a better/alternative repair fitting than cutting off a repair flange & using that like i stated in 1st post
                    not only that, the owners give my father 99% of his work & just about pay both of our salaries
                    going to them & telling them the ONLY resolution is to tear out entire 4' concrete floor (possibly condeming entire building as well as the Paramount Theater which is attached), 8 urinals, & who knows what else in a Historic - 1 of a kind building - isnt how we work
                    I don't know of any other more permanent applications based on the info at this time.

                    Of course I understand how important your customers comfort is.

                    Maybe a picture or two can help.

                    Macguyvering is not my specialty

                    I would like to see you make your customer happy and still put something in that's going to work properly and at the same time last more than a year or two.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                      Can you start chipping from underneath till you get to some good pipe you can connect to?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                        If you want a McGyver solution,

                        get a PVC heating oven that will take the 3" PVC or what ever size you need, heat it until it is pliable and either form it around a smaller pipe, (I think you will need to work it around a mandrel or core of some type to stretch and reduce it' diameter, of course the closer to the finished size you can be the better), then re heat it and stick the smaller end into the broken off PVC, and reach in with a gloved hand and expand it back out to as close to the interior of the broken CI, and then glue or couple it back up to the existing plumbing, (electricians use PVC benders to make sweeps),

                        then use if necessary some oakum or similar and caulking to seal it up, (but if you even jsut had 4" to 6" in the CI pipe I would think it would be enough.

                        the other possibility is (I have not seen "expansion joints in pluming"), but I have seen expansion joints in PVC, electrical services, and it consists of a tube that slips inside of another tube, maybe one halve of one of those would work with "making it" as I first described,
                        http://www.onlineelectricsupplies.co...m/subcatid/123

                        or even something like these bell reducers, on EBay Item number: 200164910003
                        http://cgi.ebay.com/Two-PVC-Electric...QQcmdZViewItem

                        maybe the bell end on some conduits, http://www.alliedsupport.com/images/PVCcollage.jpg
                        a basic catalog of electrical PVC fittings,
                        http://www.alliedsupport.com/literat...VC_Catalog.pdf

                        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                        some one was showing a number days ago, some type of interior pipe repair, where they made up an epoxy mat and then inserted it on a expandable tube, and then expanded the epoxy mat out into the inside of the pipe making a new lining, now put or grind it off nice and flat, have some one with that type of repair and put a new piece on top and seam the two together with the repair boot. then you have new pipe on top a good seal and nearly no chance of leaks.

                        http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/sho...ght=pipe+liner
                        Last edited by BHD; 10-23-2007, 01:33 PM.
                        Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
                        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                        "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
                        attributed to Samuel Johnson
                        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                        PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                          WOW,THIS JOB JUST CHANGED !!!!! The homeless need a 60 day window, To move that broken guitar and warm beer. Of course it will be at owners expense. This is CALIF. RIGHT !
                          I can build anything You want , if you draw a picture of it , on the back of a big enough check .

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                            Originally posted by toolaholic View Post
                            WOW,THIS JOB JUST CHANGED !!!!! The homeless need a 60 day window, To move that broken guitar and warm beer. Of course it will be at owners expense. This is CALIF. RIGHT !
                            What are you talking about TOOL.
                            Yes,this is PinkoCali.The OWNER has to provide relocation and housing on top of the 60 day notice.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Flush broke CI, 4' concrete, Historic

                              That's some pretty good research BHD.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X