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  • Too Much Flux

    I am looking at a project which appears to have excessive amounts of flux residual left in the tube. The owners are complaining about a green slim at their tubs and in water being boiled at the kitchen. The project is 4-years old and they are still having the problem. Has anyone ever found a good way to remove excessive flux which is not flushed out during original construction and disinfection?

    Mark
    "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

    I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

  • #2
    Re: Too Much Flux

    4 years and still having problems?

    Go to a pool supply and buy a small bag of Chlorine crystals. Dillute it into a bucket. Pump it through the domestic system and let stand overnight. Flush, rinse and repeat.

    Worked for me a few times.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Too Much Flux

      Thanks PC - I may have left out this is a residential high-rise.

      Mark
      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Too Much Flux

        Details...details... why does everyone forget the details.

        I can't imagine it being the flux at this stage unless it sat for really a long time before being flushed.

        All units are affected or just a few?

        I would have the water throughly tested.

        The chlorine thing works but not sure how that would work in a high rise.

        Rick would have the right answer

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        • #5
          Re: Too Much Flux

          Seems that it would take an unbelievable amount of flux to cause such an amount of green in the fixtures and water. Is there anything weird about the water, such as lots of dissolved oxygen? Over-chlorination of the water will also cause corrosion.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Too Much Flux

            Originally posted by plumberscrack View Post

            Rick would have the right answer
            It will have to wait until he gets home. We are not spending the calls from Costa Rica talking about the forum. . .sorry
            I love my plumber

            "My Hero"

            Welcome, Phoebe Jacqueline!

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            • #7
              Re: Too Much Flux

              I will be very intrested to see what the resolution to this is. I too find it hard to believe that the residual flux is causing a problem, especially due to the age of the building

              Please keep us posted on this one.

              Regards,

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Too Much Flux

                Don't you have to super chlorinate your line after pressure testing? We have to for Navy projects. Is it the same as civilian side?
                Buy cheap, buy twice.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Too Much Flux

                  Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                  Thanks PC - I may have left out this is a residential high-rise.

                  Mark
                  If the system was not blown out (which I do on all my jobs), and it's been four years since anyone turned on a faucet (which is possible, if it was not leased out), I can see the problem. I would suggest turning on all valves, faucets, etc. for about two hours. If it comes back there my be other problems.
                  the dog

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Too Much Flux

                    Very good dog.

                    Okay I was at the project until about 6 PM tonight so I have a little more history. This is a project which came in the afternoon before I headed for New York and today was the follow up visit. The first time I was out there they gave me the DWP report which showed the city water at 22 parts per million of copper but 1800 parts per million at a tub. That seemed to be the worst unit with the owner complaining about a green tint to her hair and her hair breaking.

                    While I was in New York I sent a Chemist out to test water in various parts of the building. He confirmed my belief that the problem is localized to only certain units. The green slim tested to be flux which had leached some copper from the tubing. These units were for the most part sold pre-finish meaning the owner selected the fixtures and finishes and finished the units themselves. The first build out was not completed until early 2006. The unit which seems to have the biggest problem is a part-time owner who has only spent 8-weeks in the unit.

                    When I met with the board tonight I recommended we isolate the worst unit and have the Chemist collect a sample. Then I want to remove the piping to the deck mounted tub set and run two hoses in to the tub. The hoses will flush for 4 hours and then I will have the Chemist take another sample. If the copper level drops I think I can convince them to flush the rest of the system.

                    Mark
                    "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                    I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Too Much Flux

                      Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                      These units were for the most part sold pre-finish meaning the owner selected the fixtures and finishes and finished the units themselves.

                      There's the answer right there I bet; untrained hands or incorrect workmanship or materials (improper flux)


                      The liability could easily go back to the association that runs that development for even allowing this possibility to exist.

                      Not unless there's more details to your situation whereby the same person plumbed all those units.

                      They better hope they can get this matter resolved before these units keep changing ownership.
                      Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Too Much Flux

                        Originally posted by DUNBAR View Post
                        There's the answer right there I bet; untrained hands or incorrect workmanship or materials (improper flux)


                        The liability could easily go back to the association that runs that development for even allowing this possibility to exist.

                        Not unless there's more details to your situation whereby the same person plumbed all those units.

                        They better hope they can get this matter resolved before these units keep changing ownership.
                        The plumbing rough and top out was already installed but the fixtures and cabinets were not. Interesting enough the plumbers who are working for the homeowners when locations are changed have all used ProPress.

                        I have been hire to solve the problem and I'm fairly certain I will be sucessful. Another factor I may have left out is these units sell for millions of dollars as a shell so when I'm done I need to make sure I have 110% results.

                        Mark
                        "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                        I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Too Much Flux

                          I got a problem buying into the "tennant improvement" phase of this. The " top out" would have already located valves/stops etc.. NO??

                          If thats the case, the only thing the buyer would have is fixture choice and supplies. Little or no soldering there??

                          However I do buy into the statement that a unit could have been unoccupied for a time, "Stagnant".

                          I do look forward to your findings.

                          Regards,

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Too Much Flux

                            I have been into some of the shells. Each unit has three SOVs in the ceiling if the laundry room. They are hot, cold and return. The walls are up and painted but there is no floor coverings and only stub outs at fixture locations except that there are SOV and 3/4" MIP adapters at tub locations and single handle valves installed at stall showers. The buyer is responsible to hire their own designer and contractor to complete the units. One of the units which is the worst has two 3/4" water heater flexes connecting the tub valve and the rest is from original construction.

                            Because the slim is mostly at the hot I believe the hot is helping it dislodge. One of the first things I'm going to do is try and flush both hot and cold lines with the hot. I figure I can connect the laundry bibbs and the close the cold SOV and the return SOV which will give me hot to the entire unit.

                            Mark
                            "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                            I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Too Much Flux

                              Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                              The plumbing rough and top out was already installed but the fixtures and cabinets were not. Interesting enough the plumbers who are working for the homeowners when locations are changed have all used ProPress.

                              I have been hire to solve the problem and I'm fairly certain I will be sucessful. Another factor I may have left out is these units sell for millions of dollars as a shell so when I'm done I need to make sure I have 110% results.

                              Mark

                              Ahh...so just the trim kits only.


                              I did work on something similar to what you are describing. In Cincinnati we had to do remodels in these high-rise condos that were million dollar flats, the concrete floors between the stories of height were concrete core type.

                              That means all drains and water lines had to be ran through the hollow interior of the floor with limited pass-through penetrations.

                              Unbelievably difficult work, especially with the limited spacing and fighting with the main supply feeding all the upper units.

                              Spend 3 hours moving the water/drain on a lav and find out the next morning the customer wants the damn thing moved again for the 3rd time.

                              That application of plumbing dealing with those floors was nothing less than artwork in its purest form in regards to our profession.

                              I'm just glad it's all a memory. I've swayed away from working in them solely for the reason that if I had a toilet or faucet supply rupture at no fault to my own, it can literally do damage in the hundreds of thousands, not just thousands. Big difference and you affect more than one property owner in the worst case scenario.
                              Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

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