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Two handle tub/shower valves

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  • #16
    Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

    Originally posted by BAPlumber View Post
    I've used this valve a few times when replacing 2 or 3 handle valves.
    At a glance it looks like that valve has pressure balancing, but I don't see any reference to anti-scald..I miss anything?
    Also, looks like installing this would require alotta opened wall.
    I'm not seeing the advantage to installing something like this over a single handle, unless a customer has a fettish for having to play with the two handles to adjust shower temperatures...

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    • #17
      Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

      I'm with dog Symmons is the standard in California and Nevada for anything above residential construction.

      Mark
      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

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      • #18
        Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

        Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
        At a glance it looks like that valve has pressure balancing, but I don't see any reference to anti-scald..I miss anything?
        Also, looks like installing this would require alotta opened wall.
        I'm not seeing the advantage to installing something like this over a single handle, unless a customer has a fettish for having to play with the two handles to adjust shower temperatures...

        Look a little closer, it says it has scald protection. I dont know why you would want to install one of these though, looks like a pain in the *** all for nothing . Whats everyone have against single handle (Other than retros) It's 2007 folks. Get on the trolley.
        West Trail Mechanical Ltd
        Service. Commitment. Expertise.

        www.westtrailmechanical.ca

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        • #19
          Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

          Originally posted by bigPipe09 View Post
          . Whats everyone have against single handle (Other than retros) It's 2007 folks. Get on the trolley.
          I think that is the point of this valve. I gives you the ability for temp/pressure balancing when the customer wants a 2 or 3 handle valve or doesn't like the look of a smitty plate.
          Brent

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          • #20
            Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

            Originally posted by bigPipe09 View Post
            Look a little closer, it says it has scald protection. I dont know why you would want to install one of these though, looks like a pain in the *** all for nothing . Whats everyone have against single handle (Other than retros) It's 2007 folks. Get on the trolley.
            Maybe I'm wrong, but to me it looks like their reference to scald protection is in regard to the pressure balancing valve under the double handle.
            Symmons has both, anti-scald on the handle that only allows it to be opened to the point the hot mixes with cold for a setting of 112 or less (set by the plumber) and scald protection where the balancing cartridge compensates flow to the hot when flow is lost on the cold.
            I fully agree with your thoughts on single handle...aside from a fettish for the oldies, it makes no sense why someone would want to have to play with the valves for five minutes first thing every morning to get the temperatures right when all you do with a single valve is remember roughly where you ordinarily put it.
            Then there's the fact that valve looks like alot of wall has to be opened to get it in...single valve all you need is a plate to cover the hole.

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            • #21
              Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

              Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
              I'm with dog Symmons is the standard in California and Nevada for anything above residential construction.

              Mark
              The doctor we are doing a surgical clinic for went with the cheapest moen he could get.Probably cause he knows he's only going to be in these suites for a short period of time.

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              • #22
                Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                I'd like to revisit my earlier question in regard to Delta - what happened to the Monitor II? I'd think that, since it's about the only pressure-balancing single handle that it would be widely used or more companies would be copying it. There might be a few occasions where it would be difficult to fit, but it should fit the 8" center holes just fine.

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                • #23
                  Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                  Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
                  As for moen, they are very flimsy because they are all plastic inside and I don't like installing something a customer could feasibly yank apart, newer Delta's seem to be that way also.
                  I was just talking about this the other night on the chat. We have a carpenter at work who thinks he knows plumbing because he knows about primer. Our boss (also a carpenter) told us about a loose handle in one of the showers. Eager to please him with his skills, this guy proceeds to "fix" the handle and somehow pulled the cartridge right out!! Water was going everywhere. The showers were installed with the mixing valve on the backside of the shower. This "plumber" was blocking the water with his body while calling for help. They ran over to get me to help and I told them no. The guy thinks he's a plumber, let him fix his screwup. My BTL is maxed out dealing with people like that.

                  This is Delta and Sayco country. That's all you see. In 2 years time, I haven't seen any other mixing valve in homes.
                  Buy cheap, buy twice.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                    Originally posted by DuckButter View Post
                    Symmons, thats where I was going.
                    Welcome to the forum, get to know the regulars, pay attention.
                    What the others refer to as a "smitty" plate I call a "goof plate", Symmons makes one, an oval shaped chrome plate that has two screws similar to toggles that secure it to the wall and the plate is made to fit under the valves trim, it works with other valves, but you may need to cut some material from the center to conform around their trim.
                    Duckbutter, I asked about a replacement for a two handle tub/shower combination without a smitty plate.

                    In your first post you go off about another mans junk is another ones treasure and people looking cross eyed at you because you they don't use Delta. Stating that you use Symmons, who does not make a two handle tub/shower faucet.

                    Again you recommend a Symmons, who does not make a two handle faucet and you recommend using the oval chrome plate which I said customers did not like.

                    Thanks for the welcome to the forum. I am not sure what you mean by "get to know the regulars". I have been reading hear since Nov. 06. Maybe you're the one who needs to pay attention.

                    Duckbutter, I apologize if I am taking your posts the wrong way. Sometimes posts come off different than they mean.
                    Last edited by Tyman; 11-18-2007, 11:06 AM.
                    Anyone can tear a man down, few can build one up.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                      Herk,
                      I went on the Delta site and could not find that particular valve. The escutcheons look very large. Reminds me of two single handle valves.
                      It does seem like it would work as a replacement. Thanks.
                      Anyone can tear a man down, few can build one up.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                        I have brochures from Delta from about ten years ago for the Monitor. On the back side of the brochure, there is a picture of the valve itself - it has a pressure-balancing module on one side, and that side is larger than normal. Both water connections are on that side as well. The left handle is volume and the right handle is temperature.

                        But the supply houses here don't sell Delta, mostly, and I've never used one of these. They're the only two-handle I know of that meets code. Naturally, I'm curious as to why they aren't being used as replacements. Chances are they're too expensive to compete with single-handle valves on new work.

                        In this area, it seems as though when people don't like what the code says, they just don't do it, then they revise the code a few years later to match what people are doing.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                          I agree with you Herk, they do look expensive. Our inspector has ok'd replacement of two handle tub shower valves only. I would rather just install a single handle with a smitty plate but the customer gets what they want. I have my reservations about Moen, as I agree with what other have said about having too much plastic. The search goes on.
                          Anyone can tear a man down, few can build one up.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                            Originally posted by Tyman View Post
                            Duckbutter, I asked about a replacement for a two handle tub/shower combination without a smitty plate.

                            In your first post you go off about another mans junk is another ones treasure and people looking cross eyed at you because you they don't use Delta. Stating that you use Symmons, who does not make a two handle tub/shower faucet.

                            Again you recommend a Symmons, who does not make a two handle faucet and you recommend using the oval chrome plate which I said customers did not like.

                            Thanks for the welcome to the forum. I am not sure what you mean by "get to know the regulars". I have been reading hear since Nov. 06. Maybe you're the one who needs to pay attention.

                            Duckbutter, I apologize if I am taking your posts the wrong way. Sometimes posts come off different than they mean.
                            I think this is one of those times when one percieves incorrectly.I'm possitive Duck's welcome is genuine.When I invite someone in my home for a gathering I also invite them to get to know my friends
                            Last edited by drtyhands; 11-18-2007, 12:54 PM.

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                            • #29
                              Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                              I am not sure if they still make them, but Price Pfister used to have a two and a three handle pressure balancing vale. It was the 02 and the 04 series. The website is very difficult to find things on, but here are some links that should help.

                              https://pricepfister.custhelp.com/cg...i=&p_topview=1

                              https://pricepfister.custhelp.com/rn...14548_1971.jpg

                              http://www.pricepfister.com/website/...r/0X4-110A.jpg

                              https://pricepfister.custhelp.com/rn...14563_1986.jpg

                              The link for a parts explosion book for tub and shower valves. Look at pages 6, 7, 12, and 13.
                              http://www.pricepfister.com/website/...&%20Shower.pdf

                              There is also a company called Danze that makes the valves. I like to stick to more well known names myself, but this is an option. Scroll down near the bottom of this page.

                              http://www.plumbingsupply.com/danze-sheridan.html

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                              • #30
                                Re: Two handle tub/shower valves

                                Nevada Plumber,

                                Thanks for looking that up and posting links. You're right, thier site is terrible. I'm going to run all these options by the boss. I never even thought a pressure balancing valve could be had in a two handle. If I could only convince him to get a See Snake.
                                Anyone can tear a man down, few can build one up.

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