Announcement Announcement Module
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long) Page Title Module
Move Remove Collapse
X
Conversation Detail Module
Collapse
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

    For your reading pleasure!

    Walked into a job 9:00 pm Sunday night. Clogged toilet and H20 leaching under base. Removed the toilet to find wax floating in the bend. The flange rim is resting on the floor in the back and 3/4 inch high in the front. Now because I discount for my neighborhood Customers I charged them a discounted $200.00 for toilet removal and snake.

    Now these folks just got new stone flooring and would you think the installers would notify the Customer that the flange could pose a problem? Right! I explained to the Customer that the floor installers should have brought notice before the floor was installed!! They used a thick wax gasket that collapsed into the bend, which clogged the main. They also packed thinset under & around the flange.

    As it turns out the floor guy is a friend of the Customers and must live nearby, because he was over in about 20 minutes. I explained that we had limited options. One option would be to fix the flange and the non plumb bend it's attached to. The other would be to create a stone base for the toilet to rest on and we could build up the flange (one side). With a bullnosed edge, the platform could look like it was actually part of the design. The stone installer stated that he'd never attempted anything like that and shy'd away from that idea.

    I went back today and created shims out of wood. Shaped them to the contour of the toilet. Just receased enough so that either silicon or even grout could fill in without any signs of shimming. Now this took some time and multiple lifts of the toilet. The toilet is now perfectly level, with absolutely no wobble.

    I called the floor installer and stated that I was going to charge him a whopping $100 dollars for the work (he paid the original $200). With that he stated that he shouldn't have to pay extra, because I should have completed the job Sunday night (10:00). I remainded him that it was not possible because we were playing around with options (platform & reinstalling the flange) and that shimming as it turned out just happened to by the best cost effective option. He then went on to state that I was a Shiester Plumber, did crappy work and just wanted to bilk the Customer. I told him that I noticed nervousness and wavering in his voice and that was usually a sign of defense and or guilt. He did sorta freak out after that!

    Since I'm not shy of business and have 100's of really happy clients, I quietly said: "That okay, I fully realize were you're coming from (guilt) and that you can have the job for free" and "maybe you can create shims out of the left over stone, contour them with your wet saw and make it look professional".

    My question is: Are wood shims (solid wood & tapered) a viable way to shim a toilet?

    Thanks for reading!

  • #2
    Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

    I would stay away from it even if the wax seal never leaks moisture from conensation, getting out of the shower etc. can still get to the wood leading to mold rot etc. Also wood expands and contracts over its life leading to a wobbling toilet and eventually leaks. even if it doesnt expand it will shrink leading to the above as well. This isnt going to work in the long run. use tile or something if you have to but not wood. You are just asking for problems.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

      I agree with the spinner, stay away, the final guy who touches bought it

      have that jerk installer come back and fix it right, or you fix it right and call it a day. you won;t be doing anyone a favor with a halfazzed job.

      sucks to be in the position in the first place.
      Last edited by westcoastplumber; 05-14-2008, 10:33 PM.
      sigpic

      Robert

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

        The quick answer is no. You did a great job trying to help your customer. But your talking about a wet area. Either by leakage, spillage, missing, or condensation the wood breaks down. Seen it.

        It does kind of make me mad that a toilet ever rocks and we're always thought to be responsible for correcting this. Just imagine if we all refused to level toilets and made every tileperson come back and remove/relevel their tile. My toilet doesn't rock, the floor is out of level.

        J.C.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

          Wood will rot out. Hard plastic shims and have the moron come back and grout the toilet to the floor joint. Looks much more professional that way. Let the moron spend some of his gas money.
          WE LIVE IN THE LAND OF THE FREE,
          ONLY BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

            Chauncey ...From the land of the Teutles (Orange County Choppers) Welcome its good to have another New Yorker on the board!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

              Theoretically wood shims are bad, realistically I've pulled quite a few toilets that had wood shims with no sign of decay. I'm not sure of the age of the shims though so take it with a grain of salt.
              Buy cheap, buy twice.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                Love the Teutles dude!!! OCC rocks!!! Can't wait to own one of their production bikes, really hard to talk the wife into it though
                sigpic

                Robert

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                  Plastic shims ARE the best to use. They are easy to trim off with a razor knife once installed and will not rot.

                  I have also used short pieces of M copper smashed flat and stacked on top each other if needed.

                  My preference is to just make the repair to bring the collar to the proper level for a solid toilet install with no shims but we all know that doesn't always fly with the home owner for a number of reasons.

                  Your supply house should have the small wedge shaped plastic shims. I buy em by the bag.
                  www.firstresponsedrain.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                    Originally posted by wrench spinner View Post
                    Chauncey ...From the land of the Teutles (Orange County Choppers) Welcome its good to have another New Yorker on the board!
                    Hey they just got lucky they build a crappy bike if you really look at the workmanship close up. Looks like my kid welded some of them. Discovery channel should find Vinnie Dimartino he is building real bikes.
                    WE LIVE IN THE LAND OF THE FREE,
                    ONLY BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                      Ever wonder how the ancient Romans broke those large rock blocks off to build the structures they made from stone?

                      Wood...they wedged wood into the cracks and poured water onto them...the wood would swell and break off the huge blocks, they would then shape them by hand.

                      In other words, never put wood under a toilet, never!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                        i use the plastic ones when i have to. that said, i recently removed a toilet the lady said had not beenmoved in over 5 years and it had 3 hard wood shims in place. no sign of rot or deterioration. go figure.

                        steve
                        In the never ending struggle to keep the water flowing.... The Poo Poo Cowboy rides again!!!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                          I like the plastic/composite shims at hd and others that are sold in lieu of the traditional cedar ones for door frames, etc. Plastic, so no rot, and snap off nice and clean wherever you want them to. With these I can shim the toilet with it in place and they snap off easily right at the edge of the pocelain, which I find difficult to do with the little clear plastic ones sold specifically for toilets.
                          This is my reminder to myself that no good will ever come from discussing politics or religion with anyone, ever.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                            hey guys, iv been lurking around for quite a while and decided to put in my .02

                            when shimming toilets i use 1 1/2 wide strips of shower pan liner, especially on tile floors. just stack under each corner until the bowl stops rocking.

                            once you tighten the bolts is like sitting on a rock, then just trim off excess with a sharp blade.

                            iv used the wedges before but this is the best iv found.

                            i cant count how many toilets iv set but never been called back for a leak or rocking bowl.

                            Thanks
                            Larry

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Shim material (under toilet) (rant) (long)

                              Originally posted by BCPLUMBER View Post
                              hey guys, iv been lurking around for quite a while and decided to put in my .02

                              when shimming toilets i use 1 1/2 wide strips of shower pan liner, especially on tile floors. just stack under each corner until the bowl stops rocking.

                              once you tighten the bolts is like sitting on a rock, then just trim off excess with a sharp blade.

                              iv used the wedges before but this is the best iv found.

                              i cant count how many toilets iv set but never been called back for a leak or rocking bowl.

                              Thanks
                              Larry
                              Larry, thats excellent advice and perfect timing for me...just wrapped up a liner a few days ago and have a pile of the 40 mil scrap in the back of my truck awaiting a dump run tomorrow.
                              The plastic shims (wedges) sold for toilets are a pain in the keyster to cut.
                              Welcome to the forum.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X