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How is this legal?

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  • #16
    Re: How is this legal?

    Originally posted by gear junkie View Post
    There's this plumbing supply house where retired master plumbers work and they were talking about this earlier in the week. This is what they said; a commercial kitchen sink has the 3 compartments. Wash, rinse, sanitize. By draining into a floor drain, this allows an air gap which is extra insurance in case of a stoppage.
    ben this only applies to prep sinks where there is a chance that food can come into contact with waste from a stoppage. not typically with dishwashing sinks.

    rick.
    phoebe it is

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    • #17
      Re: How is this legal?

      Originally posted by TomSV650 View Post
      Only thing I can ad is, just imagine that your snaking a lav sink and the snake comes out of the floor drain flopping around. To clear the stoppage you have to run it from the floor drain.

      What I don't understand is, it seems to me you would get sewer gasses from the sink(since the pipe ties in above the trap on the floor drain) and also since the lav sink is on the same wall as the toilet, that usually means the lav vent is tied into the toilet vent and you would get sewer gases from that also.

      Am I making any sense?
      I think some of us are having a hard time with your description. Are you saying the lav ties into the tailpiece of the floor sink as opposed to an indirect drain with an air-break?

      Mark
      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: How is this legal?

        Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
        ben this only applies to prep sinks where there is a chance that food can come into contact with waste from a stoppage. not typically with dishwashing sinks.

        rick.
        You got me thinking and in the Navy galley(kitchen), everything drains into floor drains expect for small sinks. I'll keep my eyes open some more.
        Buy cheap, buy twice.

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        • #19
          Re: How is this legal?

          Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
          I think some of us are having a hard time with your description. Are you saying the lav ties into the tailpiece of the floor sink as opposed to an indirect drain with an air-break?

          Mark
          That's how I see it in my minds eye

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          • #20
            Re: How is this legal?

            i had to look at other types, trap primers,dishwasher,condensate all dump into branch tailpieces.condensate does not have the airbreak. upc supports one trap upto three outlets,at no more than 30" centers. trap is center. ,a plumbing manufacturer makes a device that takes a portion waste water from a tailpiece diverts it to the f.d. for trap seal. what then would be the difference? the air break or gap to prevent cross contamination,if your going from drain to drain,thats eliminated. it's a clever solution to a problem

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            • #21
              Re: How is this legal?

              This is usually in strip malls, shopping centers ect. Not Commercial kitchen areas. The Lav(also seen urinals) ties into the tail piece of a floor drain.

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              • #22
                Re: How is this legal?

                Originally posted by stokefire7 View Post
                i had to look at other types, trap primers,dishwasher,condensate all dump into branch tailpieces.condensate does not have the airbreak. upc supports one trap upto three outlets,at no more than 30" centers. trap is center. ,a plumbing manufacturer makes a device that takes a portion waste water from a tailpiece diverts it to the f.d. for trap seal. what then would be the difference? the air break or gap to prevent cross contamination,if your going from drain to drain,thats eliminated. it's a clever solution to a problem
                I don't believe this would apply as they have to be adjacent to each other and/or the same depth.

                Mark
                "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: How is this legal?

                  Originally posted by TomSV650 View Post
                  This is usually in strip malls, shopping centers ect. Not Commercial kitchen areas. The Lav(also seen urinals) ties into the tail piece of a floor drain.
                  If you get a chance take a picture of the next one you see.

                  Mark
                  "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                  I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: How is this legal?

                    i' m coming from a point of theory,a trap primer is doing what the right honorable gentleman is describing.size of branch could equal to tailpiece
                    Last edited by stokefire7; 05-17-2008, 02:09 AM.

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                    • #25
                      Re: How is this legal?

                      Originally posted by stokefire7 View Post
                      i' m coming from a point of theory,a trap primer is doing what the right honorable gentleman is describing.size of branch could equal to tailpiece
                      I wonder about the trap primer but since the code requires an automatic means of maintaining the trap seal the lav wouldn't work. The other question is how could it be double trapped.

                      I can't find anything under the UPC which would allow the installation and under the IPC it would be prohibited.

                      Mark
                      "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                      I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: How is this legal?

                        what i'm seeing with this is applying two different issues to drainage, branch tailpiece , indirect waste guide lines . going back to one trap serving up to three outlets . those three outlets at the same level,by volume one cannot over take the other(lavs,three compartment sinks). in this instance we have a minor over a major

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                        • #27
                          Re: How is this legal?

                          I'm not sure as there are just too many things that don't sound right. The double trap is okay if the lav is truly an indirect drain. However, the Code requires a sink to drain into the plumbing fixture though an air-gap or air-break. Then as far as the trap primer goes the Code requires the primer to be automatic. I'm sure there is something that is missing here and it may be related to how old the building is and what the Code was at the time.

                          Mark
                          "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                          I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: How is this legal?

                            Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                            I wonder about the trap primer but since the code requires an automatic means of maintaining the trap seal the lav wouldn't work. The other question is how could it be double trapped.

                            I can't find anything under the UPC which would allow the installation and under the IPC it would be prohibited.

                            Mark
                            What are we calling automatic? The mechanical trap primers we see need to be activated by usage of the fixture they are closest to.Same as a trap seal being maintained by a tailpiece diverter(flushometer or lav waste).Used a bunch of the flushometer tailpiece diverters for a trap primer.I don't like the access doors needed for mechanical primers destroying my customers nice tile wall.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: How is this legal?

                              Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post
                              ben this only applies to prep sinks where there is a chance that food can come into contact with waste from a stoppage. not typically with dishwashing sinks.

                              rick.
                              I would like to see this subject brought to the finish line.I have installed close to a hundred three compartment sinks in restaurants and grocery stores.Three compartment and food prep indirect.The health department spooks me more than a city inspector.They are way more likely to address this issue.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: How is this legal?

                                Originally posted by drtyhands View Post
                                What are we calling automatic? The mechanical trap primers we see need to be activated by usage of the fixture they are closest to.Same as a trap seal being maintained by a tailpiece diverter(flushometer or lav waste).Used a bunch of the flushometer tailpiece diverters for a trap primer.I don't like the access doors needed for mechanical primers destroying my customers nice tile wall.
                                Excellent point. As the code requires an approved atomatic means I guess it really comes down to whether the inspector buys it.

                                Mark
                                "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                                I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                                Comment

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