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  • Miele dishwashers

    I installed a miele dishwasher, and there were a few parts that didn't show in their lovely picture book installation instructions, so I decided to give them a jingle to make sure I wasn't missing anything. Turns out all the pieces I had extra were in fact extra, and he told me what they were. Then he told me that in CA miele DW's didn't require an airgap. It took me by surprise, I know they have some sort of backflow prevention, but never heard of such a blanket rule. Needless to say, it got an airgap, but will ask the inspector at final.

    Greg

  • #2
    Re: Miele dishwashers

    Gotta confess, never heard of a Miele dishwasher. Highest end I've seen or worked on are Asko or Fisher & Paykel. Some Bosch.

    You did the right install though. Or the inspector would make you do it again.

    J.C.

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    • #3
      Re: Miele dishwashers

      Some cities will let you get away with it.Don't try it in Santa Monica.A few homeowners were pissed because the reason they bought it was to get away from having to put it on their beautiful granite countertop.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Miele dishwashers

        Miele is real high end stuff. Whisper quiet.
        The code says - No double trapping, and since the miele and most other dishwashers including the el cheepo ones, take the drain hose, up the side and then down, forming a trap, adding another would be a no no. I have had this conversation with quite a few inspectors and have had to actually show them the piping on the dishwasher as well as the spot in the code book in order to properly educate them.
        sigpic

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        • #5
          Re: Miele dishwashers

          all the higher end machine have a built in back flow protector built into fill line.

          typically they don't require an air gap. but some cities like adam said go overboard.

          santa monica is now requiring meter protection on both the domestic and fire. in fact they are removing the meters from the ground and installing them above ground.

          have a fancy building that was built in 1995 that is going to require updating.

          rick.
          phoebe it is

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Miele dishwashers

            Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
            Miele is real high end stuff. Whisper quiet.
            The code says - No double trapping, and since the miele and most other dishwashers including the el cheepo ones, take the drain hose, up the side and then down, forming a trap, adding another would be a no no. I have had this conversation with quite a few inspectors and have had to actually show them the piping on the dishwasher as well as the spot in the code book in order to properly educate them.
            I don't understand your point.Where is the siphon break keeping the sink from backflushing into the machine.Would the washing machine hose trap not need a vent through the roof.

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            • #7
              Re: Miele dishwashers

              Where I live we don't need an air gap just a loop and I have never seen a problem

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              • #8
                Re: Miele dishwashers

                Originally posted by drtyhands View Post
                I don't understand your point.Where is the siphon break keeping the sink from backflushing into the machine.Would the washing machine hose trap not need a vent through the roof.
                In addition the plumbing portion of the dishwasher drain does not start until after the pumped section. At that point it is an indirect waste and must be graded the same as any other drain line. I see a bunch of 7/8" dishwasher hoses where guys have a big belly in them. Not only will the water not drain out of the 7/8" hose but water from the sink gets trapped there as well. The next thing you know the customer is asking why her disposal always smells so bad.

                Mark
                "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Miele dishwashers

                  Originally posted by ToUtahNow View Post
                  In addition the plumbing portion of the dishwasher drain does not start until after the pumped section. At that point it is an indirect waste and must be graded the same as any other drain line. I see a bunch of 7/8" dishwasher hoses where guys have a big belly in them. Not only will the water not drain out of the 7/8" hose but water from the sink gets trapped there as well. The next thing you know the customer is asking why her disposal always smells so bad.

                  Mark
                  A lot of UMMMM "PLUMBERS" use longer hose so they can make the radius from the air gap to the disposal.

                  TIP...
                  Store 7/8" hose in a 12" radius bucket.Over a short period of time it will be able to be installed in a tighter radius without kinking.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Miele dishwashers

                    Originally posted by drtyhands View Post
                    A lot of UMMMM "PLUMBERS" use longer hose so they can make the radius from the air gap to the disposal.

                    TIP...
                    Store 7/8" hose in a 12" radius bucket.Over a short period of time it will be able to be installed in a tighter radius without kinking.
                    Here is an example of a poorly installed 7/8" hose. How in the world did the plumber think the dirty water would ever drain out of the hose?

                    Mark
                    Attached Files
                    "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                    I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Miele dishwashers

                      Anything less than an Air Gap is a direct connection to the waste line.


                      Prove me wrong.



                      One punch of a plunger and you've just taken contamination back to a device that produces sterile good for eating/consuming food and liquids.


                      It might be laxed in your state but on a commercial/industrial front, it's a global code that is strongly enforced.

                      Less risk in the residential realm? Of course......but remember those homeowners that shouldn't have even a hose clamp in their hands.


                      If the device has its own backflow device, it's supposed to accessible for maintaining along with the ability to be free of moving parts (mechanical) which as we all know fails given time, incidental debri, product defect.
                      Last edited by DUNBAR PLUMBING; 06-27-2008, 12:04 AM.
                      Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

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                      • #12
                        Re: Miele dishwashers

                        So at best it's a city by city decision. I stand by my decision to keep it in there.

                        Greg

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                        • #13
                          Re: Miele dishwashers



                          mark, what did they expect when they installed a badger 1, pressed steel sink with hoodie ring, poly feed lines, price phister pull out, and basket strainer with cadmium s.j. nut.

                          actually i like the telescoping 2 part waste as i feel it last longer than brass and same with the plastic air gap.

                          a 3/4'' copper st. 90 usually will clean up the hose sag.

                          rick.
                          phoebe it is

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                          • #14
                            Re: Miele dishwashers

                            In my area the builders have figured out how to get around it completely; have the plumber install it correctly,


                            remove the Air Gap and put in the important soap dispensor the customer wanted....not understanding the value of the Air Gap.


                            My plumbing inspector days ........someday will have me wearing steel armor to protect me from angry plumbers who think they can skirt the code.
                            Northern Kentucky Plumbers Twitter Feed | Plumbing Videos

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                            • #15
                              Re: Miele dishwashers

                              Originally posted by PLUMBER RICK View Post


                              mark, what did they expect when they installed a badger 1, pressed steel sink with hoodie ring, poly feed lines, price phister pull out, and basket strainer with cadmium s.j. nut.

                              actually i like the telescoping 2 part waste as i feel it last longer than brass and same with the plastic air gap.

                              a 3/4'' copper st. 90 usually will clean up the hose sag.

                              rick.
                              A competitive built condo with entry level plumbing.

                              Mark
                              "Somewhere a Village is Missing Twelve Idiots!" - Casey Anthony

                              I never lost a cent on the jobs I didn't get!

                              Comment

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