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  • #61
    Re: water heater heat loss

    I have to admit that the first time I saw water heater tanks I thought to myself: what is THAT? Always used a tankless, most of Europe does. Some call it Junkers for one of the factories that has been making them for decades. They are installed in kitchens, or bathrooms or little nukes here and there, even in apartment buildings.

    I know people who bought a place I once lived in changed their tankless after 10 years. Not because it didn't work, but they just had spare cash and wanted to change the decor in the bathroom. I had lived there 9 years before that. Altogether 19 years, and as suggested here, maintenance was a non issue. Some vinegar once a year and some over the counter, inexpensive and DIY parts, perhaps twice during the life of the heater. In the 9 years a maintenance guy came once - a routine (and free) inspection.

    That was in 1970's/1980's. The technology must have gotten only better.
    I have a huge ugly boiler heater with forced exhaust and I will be replacing it next Spring with a Rinnai.
    In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion.

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    • #62
      Re: water heater heat loss

      Originally posted by darius View Post
      I have to admit that the first time I saw water heater tanks I thought to myself: what is THAT? Always used a tankless, most of Europe does. Some call it Junkers for one of the factories that has been making them for decades. They are installed in kitchens, or bathrooms or little nukes here and there, even in apartment buildings.

      I know people who bought a place I once lived in changed their tankless after 10 years. Not because it didn't work, but they just had spare cash and wanted to change the decor in the bathroom. I had lived there 9 years before that. Altogether 19 years, and as suggested here, maintenance was a non issue. Some vinegar once a year and some over the counter, inexpensive and DIY parts, perhaps twice during the life of the heater. In the 9 years a maintenance guy came once - a routine (and free) inspection.

      That was in 1970's/1980's. The technology must have gotten only better.
      I have a huge ugly boiler heater with forced exhaust and I will be replacing it next Spring with a Rinnai.
      I WILL say this...
      Paloma used to boast their tankless's would outlast 20 years, we don't hear that anymore.
      State heaters over 15 years ago were notorious for lasting well into the teens.
      Now they often barely make warranty.
      I really think MFG's caught on to the fact that longevity isn't very lucrative.
      As for tankless's life spans...I'll have to get back to you on that, in say, 10 years or so.

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      • #63
        Re: water heater heat loss

        i too was first exposed (1989) to tankless point of use heaters while traveling in fiji.

        the beach resort had them in their cottages and were indoor non vented units

        now keep in mind, that these were small units and had no electronics whatsoever.

        if you ever decide to look into a modern tankless, it resembles the electronics inside of a laptop computer.

        there is no such thing as a $3.00 thermocouple inside of a tankless.

        i've serviced and repaired many raypacks and larrs units. these are childs play compared to the modern tankless of today.

        standard tank water heaters have 2 parts that can fail. a thermocouple or a gas valve. pre fvir heaters were pretty much interchangeable parts. the new fvir heaters are proprietary.

        good luck when the tankless stops working.$$$

        95% of the tank heaters i've replaced have never been serviced or drained.

        rick.
        phoebe it is

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        • #64
          Re: water heater heat loss

          Originally posted by SlimTim View Post
          ...
          Have you had this unit during an Idaho winter yet?. What is your incoming water temp?

          Seriously, how often do all six of you have to take a shower within an hour?
          Have not been through an Idaho winter yet with a tankless ... my story may change

          Every Sunday prior to church. All of the bathing happens within the space of an hour. People might not be "ready" in an hour because people still have to get dressed and the like after the shower.

          Having all of us showering at the same time in the same shower would definitely save water ... got a kick out of that one

          Right now my oldest are 8 and 7. I do not think that they have "appreciated" a long shower quite yet. My daughter however has started to sing a lot more while in the shower, so it is only a matter of time ...

          I do have a 3 year old and a 1 year, so in a few years, once they start showing and the older ones are teenagers, then things will definitely take longer ... perhaps alternative methods like having a few shower at night might have to happen.

          Some feedback as far as my experiences thus far:

          Both showers can go at the same time without a hitch. I have had six sources go at the same time for testing, straight hot, and yes, hot water pressure gets pretty dismal. Thus far, I have not really tested how many sources can go before I start noticing lack of hot water in the shower. ( Not sure if I want to ) All I can say is that I have not noticed a hot water drop, or tempurature, yet with "normal" use.

          I will say when the toilet flushes I do notice a drop in pressure (versus temperature) in my shower a little. Same when the other shower goes, but the temp of the shower water does not change in both cases. This existed when I had the tank too. If other sources are getting used while I have been in the shower, I can't say that I have noticed it.

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