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Plumbing Mystery Help?

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  • #61
    Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

    Originally posted by wrench spinner View Post
    Pick me up at the airport and buy lunch, my ticket is only about 80 round trip!
    Won't rule this out yet. Thanks.

    J.C.

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    • #62
      Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

      Originally posted by Devine Plumbing View Post
      If you have turned both the hot and cold off to that heater and still have full pressure from the hot side of that line that theoritically eliminates any problem with a recirculating line/check valves. There are either one of two scenerios that I can think of, a cross connection somewhere on the first floor, or the hot line from the second floor heater is connected to the first floor system causing them to run in parallel and you have a cross connection on the second floor or the second floor water heater is being depleted and causing the cold water coming from the hot taps. You may try turning off both water heaters simultaneously and see if the hot water tap still has pressure. If it does not it would eliminate the possibility of a cross connection and the hot systems must be tied together at some point. However, if it does then you would know that you were looking for a cross connection at some fixture, either on the first or second floor.
      Did this. So it leads me to a cross connection. I'm still suspicious of a partially dropped gate on the inlet side of the water heater.

      Going to attack it again tomorrow night.

      Thanks all. I'll post what I find for all interested.

      J.C.

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      • #63
        Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

        My money is on the washing machine, just because I've seen it happen during W/H swaps. Another contractor put one in and when only hot came out of both sides of the kitchen faucet they surmised that the heater must be bad and wanted to return it to the supply house. The supply house begged me to go out and look at. It was on my way home so when I got there I turned off the washing machine first and lo and behold everything worked perfect. Gave the homeowner my card and the name of a good appliance repairman and the contractor a good chewing out for putting in water heaters without the proper knowledge, permits, or licensing.
        Last edited by Devine Plumbing; 04-15-2009, 03:01 PM.
        Distractions are everywhere, don't lose sight of your dream.

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        • #64
          Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

          Has this problem been there the whole time or did it disappear for 2 months and just now come back?

          I've had a couple of washing machine selonoid failures but none of them gave me full pressure through the valve.

          Jobs like this will make your hair fall out

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          • #65
            Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

            Originally posted by plumberscrack View Post
            Has this problem been there the whole time or did it disappear for 2 months and just now come back?

            I've had a couple of washing machine selonoid failures but none of them gave me full pressure through the valve.

            Jobs like this will make your hair fall out
            I have been told that all was good until about 1 week ago. The second floor is working as it should now. Just to remind this is the floor with a separate 40 gallon water heater.

            It supplies 6-2 handle sinks WITH Watts temp controls & check valves. All working as they should.
            It also supplies 1 wall mount break room sink with NO temp controls.
            Finally, it supplies 1 washing machine.

            No complaints on this floor. Everything doing what it should to my knowledge. I've traced the hotwater line off of this 40 gallon heater myself-twice-through the lower ceiling to make sure every connection goes through the floor and to a fixture. If it does something else in the wall I have no way of knowing.

            The Rheem-119 gallon-Electric on the bottom floor supplies everything else. The kitchen that is on an ADJOINING WALL will have scalding water for about 30 seconds, then slowly cool to room temperature in about 60 seconds.

            When I say adjoining wall I mean water heater on one side-kitchen on the other and a sink less than 5 foot away but maybe 20 foot of running pipe.

            Thanks. Hair.....getting.....weak.....must......fall.....i n.......drain.

            J.C.
            Last edited by BobsPlumbing; 04-15-2009, 05:31 PM.

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            • #66
              Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

              Are there any single handle shower mixing valves on the third floor? Turn both the hot and cold off to the third floor water heater, turn on a hot tap and listen. Pipe noise may lead you to the culprit. Also, try investigating the accessible cold water lines by feel. They may lead you to the cross connection.

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              • #67
                Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                Ok when you turned the valves off on the heater you still had full pressure at the top floor hot side, right?

                What about at the kitchen?, same?

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                • #68
                  Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                  Originally posted by plumberscrack View Post
                  Ok when you turned the valves off on the heater you still had full pressure at the top floor hot side, right?

                  What about at the kitchen?, same?
                  Yes. I turned the valves off to both heaters. There is a shutoff on the inlet and the outlet of both heaters. I turned all of them off. There are shutoffs on both sides of the recirc pump. I turned both of them off.

                  Total of 6 valves.

                  Then I sent someone to the top floor to check for water out of the hot side. My thinking is I could get a false reading on the bottom floor as water would be coming down for awhile. Vacuums fail if you know what I mean.

                  I had them run the water for about 3 minutes. Water comes out of the hot side with no loss of pressure. I also checked the water at the kitchen afterwards and had water on the hot side there.

                  J.C.

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                  • #69
                    Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                    Originally posted by Plumbus View Post
                    Are there any single handle shower mixing valves on the third floor? Turn both the hot and cold off to the third floor water heater, turn on a hot tap and listen. Pipe noise may lead you to the culprit. Also, try investigating the accessible cold water lines by feel. They may lead you to the cross connection.
                    There are NO shower valves in the building. I have felt many pipes there but could have missed something.

                    Thanks.

                    J.C.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                      you let someone else check the faucets upstairs? Are you confident that they did exactly as you told them?

                      Valves on both sides of heaters....hmmmm....very interesting. Not sure why yet but still interesting. Is it a clue? maybe?

                      Let's review the basics:
                      Have you confirmed that cold goes in on the right side of heaters and hot comes out on the left?

                      Next trip out, pull the relief valve and poke your Explorer in there to check diptube position and condition.

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                      • #71
                        Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                        I think itt may be time to cut in a new valve in the basement right next to that pile of old newspapers. Begin soldering at 11:58a.m. and leave promptly at noon for lunch, absent mindedly forgetting to turn off your torch
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                        • #72
                          Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                          Originally posted by plumberscrack View Post
                          you let someone else check the faucets upstairs? Are you confident that they did exactly as you told them?

                          Valves on both sides of heaters....hmmmm....very interesting. Not sure why yet but still interesting. Is it a clue? maybe?

                          Let's review the basics:
                          Have you confirmed that cold goes in on the right side of heaters and hot comes out on the left?

                          Next trip out, pull the relief valve and poke your Explorer in there to check diptube position and condition.
                          I am pretty confident in the person. I had them on the phone and heard the water running myself.

                          I've checked/felt the temp on the pipe of the second floor heater. Cold & hot going where they should. No complaints on this floor/system.

                          The bottom floor heater is:

                          Rheem-119 gallon-High Recovery Electric.
                          Bottom Fed
                          Hot/top outlet will almost scald you.
                          Bottom line coming in is cool or cold to touch.

                          I know, I know-I've racked my brain and it's pissed me off too.

                          J.C.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                            Why did it mysteriously disappear then reappear? That's what I don't get. What's changed?

                            If it's a crossover somewhere in the wall it would do it all the time, right?

                            One thing is for sure...you're screwed

                            I can't get bogged down in this, JC. I have problems of my own I need to deal with

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                            • #74
                              Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                              Originally posted by plumberscrack View Post
                              Why did it mysteriously disappear then reappear? That's what I don't get. What's changed?

                              If it's a crossover somewhere in the wall it would do it all the time, right?

                              One thing is for sure...you're screwed

                              I can't get bogged down in this, JC. I have problems of my own I need to deal with
                              My will is stronger than any plumbing problem.

                              I WILL PREVAIL!


                              It might be a K-60 cone or grease part in the hot line.

                              Thanks for trying.

                              J.C.
                              Last edited by BobsPlumbing; 04-15-2009, 04:24 PM.

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                              • #75
                                Re: Plumbing Mystery Help?

                                With all of the valves turned off and that pressure remaining tells me that there must be a cross connection somewhere. Sounds to me like its time for a repipe. I'm having a tendency to agree with Gene, if it wasn't a church you could just burn it down. OOPS!
                                Last edited by Devine Plumbing; 04-15-2009, 05:13 PM.
                                Distractions are everywhere, don't lose sight of your dream.

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