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PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

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  • #31
    Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

    Originally posted by PLUMBER01 View Post
    I would have to disagree with ya on that 420Paul, just for the simple reason that I have to this date not had a problem with CPVC or the fittings used, but have heard stories on the Pex and had one issue with a manufacture defect on a part used, and it was an Ugly mess, I will say since then I have only begun to use Wirsbo and have not had problems yet, but feel that I have not used alot of it to determine the longevity of it either
    Other than cpvc failing when it comes in contact with wd-40, pesticides, caulking, excessive heat, excessive glue, too many other chemicals to list, and becoming brittle after about 10-12 years, cpvc is some good stuff.

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    • #32
      Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

      Originally posted by 420paul View Post
      becoming brittle after about 10-12 years, cpvc is some good stuff.
      When it is installed wrong or outside without insulation or in Attics with excesive temperature changes, If installed right the life expectancy should be 20-30 years and that is using the Flow Guard Gold, I don't use that ACE hardware crap and maybe that is what you are talking about
      I don't bite my finger nails, I KNOW when payday is, and yes, it can run uphill when it gets blocked(or you install a grinder pump) so HA!!!!

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

        [QUOTE=NHMaster3015;306852]




        Quote:
        Originally Posted by nhmaster3015
        ]

        you need to read the original question you posted.

        Of course i soldered with water in the line. I've done 6'' copper in between floors when the building had no water for 2 days and they brought me in at midnight. I finished in 5 hours by myself when they had a crew for 2 days.

        Well, i don't solder with water in the line, i stuff a jet swett in there and the appropriate fitting. Either a ball valve or a union or a drip coupling.

        Now with propress, i would finish in minutes. Show me you can prep and solder a 1/2''- 4'' copper fitting in 5 seconds. I'll show you that i can do it and not even worry about water running or dripping.

        5 seconds is nice but i'm charging the full hour anyway and the difference is probably 3 minutes.


        Show me your inventory of long sweep 90's. Every propress 90 i have is long sweep and type k or heavier.

        Why do you need long sweep 90's. The code does not require them and neither is there a need for type k with a soldered fitting.

        Don't know why none of your guys use it, is it because you as the owner don't approve and therefore the guys don't use it. There is not 1 plumber or building engineer i've showed and used it on that doesn't want 1.

        Sure, everyone is impressed, right up till they have to pay for the darn thing and find out fittings are 3 to 10 times more expensive.

        If you buy a rolls royce, you better have the money to buy the gas for it:d

        it's the customer that bears the cost, or at least it better be if you want to keep a sign on the door.


        I know my hourly rate is more expensive than the price of a fitting. Or in this case a few fittings. Even on my commercial heater installations with 2'' fittings, i still spec and use propress.

        You have it, might as well use it but don't even begin to tell me it's more economical. I have run the cost analysis down to the penny. It is almost twice as expensive to use as soldering is even given the time savings.

        As i've discovered before, half the country or plumber here are not using water soluble flux. When you have water in a system that wont drain down, you'll soon discover propress is the way to go.

        We don't use water soluble at all around these parts.... Yet. It's not required by code here.

        Please don't tell me you have jet swet's from 1/2''- 4'' and use them every time. Then install a 4'' ball valve or union.

        I have 1/2 through 2" on the truck. 3 and 4" at the shop. All 9 vans are equipped the same.

        So the question has been answered. Propress is less expensive with the time and materials i would otherwise have to resort to.

        Take some time and really run the numbers. Be fair and then get back to us.

        Now who wants to buy my jet swet's

        Cause i have 7 propress machines waiting to lose a bet

        fool me once........ One man x 7 propress machines = money tied up needlessly.

        Rick.



        i can of course challenge every bold statement you made. but i won't at this time

        but i do need you to answer this question with concerns to your last statement about not using water soluble flux, nor is it required in these parts.

        please comment on this thread http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33848

        rick.
        phoebe it is

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

          Originally posted by PLUMBER01 View Post
          When it is installed wrong or outside without insulation or in Attics with excesive temperature changes, If installed right the life expectancy should be 20-30 years and that is using the Flow Guard Gold, I don't use that ACE hardware crap and maybe that is what you are talking about

          20 to 30 years? That's shorter than most roof's these days, no thanks. PVC is junk in my opinion. Used only by hacks here in my area. I do understand there are places you can't use copper but that's where pex comes in right?

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

            I GUARANTEE I am FAR from being a HACK!!!, I take pride in my work and my call back rate proves it. I don't overcharge my customers, I worked on Nothing but referrals, I am not even in the phone book.
            I personally will continue to use CPVC when it is called for because I have never had a problem with my installations, BECAUSE it is done right the first time, I still prefer type K copper above all esle, but have not had any issues with the CPVC that I use to render it as a useless plumbing component.
            I don't bite my finger nails, I KNOW when payday is, and yes, it can run uphill when it gets blocked(or you install a grinder pump) so HA!!!!

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

              I'm sorry, I wasn't calling you a hack. I guess every area is different. Around here it's only the unlicensed hacks using pvc. I don't know of any licensed plumbers around here that use it.

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                Originally posted by PLUMBER01 View Post
                I GUARANTEE I am FAR from being a HACK!!!, I take pride in my work and my call back rate proves it. I don't overcharge my customers, I worked on Nothing but referrals, I am not even in the phone book.
                I personally will continue to use CPVC when it is called for because I have never had a problem with my installations, BECAUSE it is done right the first time, I still prefer type K copper above all esle, but have not had any issues with the CPVC that I use to render it as a useless plumbing component.
                I think many, even myself, don't like CPVC because we don't feel like we have any "control" over the connections. And they are live connections with varying pressures.

                That makes anyone who does this uneasy. Plus the wait times for repair. With that said, I don't remember hearing of any massive recall or lawsuits for properly installed CPVC.

                I would consider it or an EP-PEX combination in an aggressive water situation.

                J.C.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                  I apologize for my Rant, I thought I was being called a HACK ha ha ha. I started my own company not as a basis for money(added bonus) but because I wanted to take care of my customers, and many of them have become friends in the process, Not I am not some avenger for a CPVC company or any thing and there are Some CPVC manufacturers I just won't use, I just can't believe there is this much hatred towards CPVC in the first place, but as I stated earlier, I only use Flow Guard Gold, I personally think Charolettes brand is crap along with others, I am also not saying it is any better or worse than PEX because I have not used Pex enough to make a claim or statement, I guess the only down side to Pex for me right now is that it can't be used outside. That and the first time I was going to use it I had to buy all the tools for it and also the company I was buying the fittings from MOORE SUPPLY They started to carry VANGUARD, but when I needed something they were transitioning into carrying ZURN, and they only had a few fittings of each and nver enough of one or the other. I think I am going to start Offering Wirsbo as an option, but nowdays with everyone wanting to go Green, I know Pex is not a recyclable material

                  To sum everything up, I have never stated CPVC to be better than(or worse) than other materials of the trade, I've just used it for years and never had anyproblems with the FGG I install, but Have repaied MANY CPVC pipes of lesser quality..And Thanks for the Apology ironranger
                  I don't bite my finger nails, I KNOW when payday is, and yes, it can run uphill when it gets blocked(or you install a grinder pump) so HA!!!!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                    Originally posted by PLUMBER01 View Post
                    I apologize for my Rant, I thought I was being called a HACK ha ha ha. I started my own company not as a basis for money(added bonus) but because I wanted to take care of my customers, and many of them have become friends in the process, Not I am not some avenger for a CPVC company or any thing and there are Some CPVC manufacturers I just won't use, I just can't believe there is this much hatred towards CPVC in the first place, but as I stated earlier, I only use Flow Guard Gold, I personally think Charolettes brand is crap along with others, I am also not saying it is any better or worse than PEX because I have not used Pex enough to make a claim or statement, I guess the only down side to Pex for me right now is that it can't be used outside. That and the first time I was going to use it I had to buy all the tools for it and also the company I was buying the fittings from MOORE SUPPLY They started to carry VANGUARD, but when I needed something they were transitioning into carrying ZURN, and they only had a few fittings of each and nver enough of one or the other. I think I am going to start Offering Wirsbo as an option, but nowdays with everyone wanting to go Green, I know Pex is not a recyclable material

                    To sum everything up, I have never stated CPVC to be better than(or worse) than other materials of the trade, I've just used it for years and never had anyproblems with the FGG I install, but Have repaied MANY CPVC pipes of lesser quality..And Thanks for the Apology ironranger
                    Thought Charlotte & Lubrizol became one and the same.

                    http://www.charlottepipe.com/Default...e=FGG&type=FGG

                    J.C.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                      Ypu're right, I meant cresline, I use Charolette for all the plastic ha ha ha That's what my main supplier sells MY BAD!!
                      I don't bite my finger nails, I KNOW when payday is, and yes, it can run uphill when it gets blocked(or you install a grinder pump) so HA!!!!

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                        but i do need you to answer this question with concerns to your last statement about not using water soluble flux, nor is it required in these parts.

                        please comment on this thread http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33848

                        rick.[/QUOTE]

                        first I had to read through all that to make sure I didn't put foot in mouth. Whew anyhooooooo around these parts that's one of dem things that everyone kinda overlooks along with purple primer. should we? yea, probably but you would have to actually order a case because none of the supply houses carry it.

                        BTW you don't have to answer to any of the above. Partly, I'm just trying to get a rise out of someone and for the most part I can appreciate the tool and I can even see why some plumbers have taken them to heart. I'm just a bit too locked in the past I suppose and I have a real hard time justifying things based on saving time. I have always had a company policy of quality over quantity. I tell all my guys to take whatever time it takes to make a good and good looking job. If we run a little long, then we run a little long. Might loose a few bucks but we always make it back on the other end because the customer is always satisfied. My motto is " It doesn't have to work, we can fix that, but at a hundred and twenty five bucks an hour it damn well better look good." Swhat separates us from the local hacks
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                          Nothing wrong with being "fast" as long as perfection is not compromised.

                          With years of experience comes perfection and quickness.
                          I know that most of you take great pride (as I do) in walking into a home and knowing exactly what needs to be done, knowing exactly what tools and materials to carry in, (in one trip). Getting the job done right the first time with no call back, getting the job done quickly.

                          I mostly do service, installations, and re-pipes. It's all about being fast for me. The more jobs we can do the more we make.

                          I pride myself in doing quality work, fast.

                          I'm not out there to make friends or to shoot the bull with my customers and they know that. I don't need to sweet talk them to keep them as a customer, it's all business. I learned a long time ago not to become good buddies with my customers, it will bite you in the arse. They call us back because we show up when we say we'll be there, get the job done quickly and do it right the first time.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                            Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                            but i do need you to answer this question with concerns to your last statement about not using water soluble flux, nor is it required in these parts.

                            please comment on this thread http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33848

                            rick.
                            first I had to read through all that to make sure I didn't put foot in mouth. Whew anyhooooooo around these parts that's one of dem things that everyone kinda overlooks along with purple primer. should we? yea, probably but you would have to actually order a case because none of the supply houses carry it.

                            BTW you don't have to answer to any of the above. Partly, I'm just trying to get a rise out of someone and for the most part I can appreciate the tool and I can even see why some plumbers have taken them to heart. I'm just a bit too locked in the past I suppose and I have a real hard time justifying things based on saving time. I have always had a company policy of quality over quantity. I tell all my guys to take whatever time it takes to make a good and good looking job. If we run a little long, then we run a little long. Might loose a few bucks but we always make it back on the other end because the customer is always satisfied. My motto is " It doesn't have to work, we can fix that, but at a hundred and twenty five bucks an hour it damn well better look good." Swhat separates us from the local hacks [/QUOTE]

                            i'll send you the best flux we have and let you use it on service work. you'll be ordering all the propress fittings in no time

                            rick.
                            phoebe it is

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                              I suspect that if we had to use water soluble we probably would
                              sigpic

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: PEX being phased out by Jan 1st?

                                CPVC - I don't like using it for the simple fact that I would feel like a "shoemaker" if I chose to use it. This has nothing to do with inground pools or irrigation..I agree with CPVC then. I also agree if a home has a HIGH Acid content in their water, and they didn't want to add an acid neutralizer.

                                I was taught the old school way, and I don't feel like a Plumber with CPVC & Pex. I feel completely stupid walking into someone's home with a PVC saw, primer and glue for water lines, or a crimping tool for Pex. Anyone can run water lines using those 2 methods. Do I think Pex and CPVC have a purpose...the answer would be YES. We are slowly but surely taking the skill out of Plumbing over the last 20 years.

                                Propress - I want one now (was against it until I found this website) but only because it gives me another option, or if I need it in a pinch. Yes it's an expensive tool to have for the reasons I want it...but I'm the type who would pay to have something sit for when I truly needed it, then not have it at all. But with all that said..I would definitely charge more for Propress versus soldering. The numbers simply don't add up not too for me and my company.
                                Last edited by Flux; 08-12-2010, 11:09 PM.

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