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  • Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

    I have a job where they have an cast indirect floor sink that they discharge near boiling water down from a pasta cooker machine. The issue is when this place was built many years ago the drain piping is all PVC. So the way they attached the drain piping is using a no-hub coupling to the bottom of the drain and to the 4" PVC riser of the trap.

    The trouble is the hot water is causing the PVC riser from the trap to become mailable and the pressure from the No-Hub clamp is deforming the pipe and causing leaks into the basement with finished ceilings of hard wood. To change out the trap to Cast iron or even copper would involve removing the finished ceiling. There is no other damage down stream to the PVC piping down stream since the couple gallons of hot water is cooled by the time it passes through the trap. Only the Riser which seeinitialnitail spike of hot water is getting damaged. So in comes this Josam SS liner. It design is to reline the old cast iron enamel coated floor sinks in areas where changing them out is not a cost effective option.

    The top of the liner fits snuggly into the floor sink as the pipe that extends down fits snug into the 4" pipe. You would apply an adhesive to all contact points and slide this in place. I have a small access to get to the riser of this p-trap and cut it out and install a fresh piece of pipe with a no-hub PVC adapter instead of straight pipe to the no-hub coupling. Once that is in place and tight I will insert this liner, which I had them extend the pipe part of the liner to a full 8" verse the stock 4" . This way it will support the PVC from the inside and prevent it from deforming from the heat and no-hub squeezing it.

    Here is a couple pics. I will post some before and after pics when I do the job.


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    Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
    Ron's Facebook
    A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
    Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
    Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

  • #2
    Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

    looks good ron. it looks just like the copper flush fitting roof drains we have that attach directly onto the roof sheating.

    is there anyway they can dump a bucket of ice into the sink prior to discharging the pasta boiler?

    rick.
    phoebe it is

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    • #3
      Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

      The floor sink is under a stove, so nope they can not easily add ice to it. One thing I did tell them while we waited for this to come (5 week lead time), is to not dump the water at closing right when the unit is turned off. Wait till morning so the water is cooled down enough to not harm the PVC.

      The reason for the 5 week lead time is these units are made to order and coming from Europe.
      Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
      Ron's Facebook
      A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
      Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
      Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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      • #4
        Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

        Get an aftercooler. Anything after that trap after some time will turn into spaghetti. If it were cast, once that coating gets wore off the inside of that cast it will rot through fast.
        AllurePlumbing.com
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        Greensboro NC, Winston-Salem NC, High Point NC, Thomasville NC, Kernersville NC

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        • #5
          Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

          I'd have to check my code book but im pretty sure you cant dump anything higher than 140 degrees down a sanitary line.

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          • #6
            Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

            Originally posted by plumberscrack View Post
            I'd have to check my code book but im pretty sure you cant dump anything higher than 140 degrees down a sanitary line.
            You cannot.
            AllurePlumbing.com
            • leak detection
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            Greensboro NC, Winston-Salem NC, High Point NC, Thomasville NC, Kernersville NC

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            • #7
              Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

              Well what about tilt kettles, when they use them to boil something. Then they open tje drain which it drains into the trough drain in front of it.

              I see lots of places with this set up and no issues. This place has been using this line dor 20+ years. The only issue is the riser pipe deforming. In all honesty I would rather tear out all the pvc and plumb it in with xh cast iron.

              The way I read the code is you can not have over 140° water go into a grease trap. By the time this reaches the grease trap its has traveled well over 200' so it has cooled down. Also it is only a couple gallons dumped each night.
              Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
              Ron's Facebook
              A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
              Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
              Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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              • #8
                Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                Also what about diahwashers? Their final rinse is 180° which is discharged into the sanitary drain. It does not drain to a grease trap though.
                Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
                Ron's Facebook
                A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
                Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
                Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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                • #9
                  Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                  Originally posted by SewerRatz View Post
                  Well what about tilt kettles, when they use them to boil something. Then they open tje drain which it drains into the trough drain in front of it.

                  I see lots of places with this set up and no issues. This place has been using this line dor 20+ years. The only issue is the riser pipe deforming. In all honesty I would rather tear out all the pvc and plumb it in with xh cast iron.

                  The way I read the code is you can not have over 140° water go into a grease trap. By the time this reaches the grease trap its has traveled well over 200' so it has cooled down. Also it is only a couple gallons dumped each night.
                  Here, its anywhere in the plumbing system. Cast will rot out within a year with temps anywhere near boiling. Get an aftercooler and do whatever you want with any pipe. Until you fix the problem (excessive hot water) you will regret it. Any HVAC supply should be able to get you one. Try looking at wholesalers that sell boilers. They are used all the time. I have been behind other contractors due to this very problem.
                  AllurePlumbing.com
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                  • drain cleaning
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                  Greensboro NC, Winston-Salem NC, High Point NC, Thomasville NC, Kernersville NC

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                  • #10
                    Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                    They know this is a temp fix to keep the riser from deforming. They also know they need to let the water in the unit cool before they dump it.
                    Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
                    Ron's Facebook
                    A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
                    Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
                    Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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                    • #11
                      Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                      Ron,

                      I take care of a restaurant. and I had a similar problem with a PVC line. Had to rip it out and install copper all the way, because of a kettle. Never had a problem since, and that was over 12 years ago.

                      Never seen a flange like you posted above...I'll keep that in mind for the future.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                        Neglected to mention a manufacturer for some of these instances......Cemline might be a start if nothing else.
                        AllurePlumbing.com
                        • leak detection
                        • drain cleaning
                        • utility locating
                        • conductor fault locating
                        • and other specialties.

                        Greensboro NC, Winston-Salem NC, High Point NC, Thomasville NC, Kernersville NC

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                          Had a similar issue with a boiler & a hotel. When they would flush it or it would flush itself it would discharge into a floor sink that had a PVC riser and trap. The ceiling below was tbar so that was easy.

                          I changed it out to copper (riser, trap and 3' of dirty arm). That was 4 years ago, hasn't been a problem since.

                          Loving those liners though, gonna remember that.
                          Ray

                          “Wealth is the product of man's capacity to think.”— Francisco d'Anconia
                          Atlas Shrugged (Part 2, Chapter 2, Page 411)

                          www.mauiplumbinginc.com

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                          • #14
                            Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                            Just a note these liners even though they line the floor sink and part of the riser pipe, they are more intended line an old enamel coated cast iron floor sink. You know the ones where the enamel or porcelain is chipped or worn off, and the cast iron is starting to rust. Here it lines the floor sink and makes a seal into the piping below the floor sink.

                            Sine the problem I am having is with the hot water and the ccompressionof the no hub coupling the top of the trap riser is being eeasilydeformed causing leaks. So I had Josam make the pipe part of the liner longer to ensure I get well into the riser pipe. Now with a sstainlesssteel insert inside the PVC it can not deform or crush under the tightness of the no-hub coupling.

                            For me to cut out the trap and replace even 3' of the waste pipe after the trap, I would have to tear down the finished wood ceiling, which is a last resort here. They are willing to try this till they are ready to redo the basement ceiling.
                            Ron Hasil Lic #058-160417
                            Ron's Facebook
                            A-Archer Sewer & Plumbing specializing in:
                            Tankless Water Heaters | Drain and Sewer Cleaning
                            Sump and Ejector Pumps | Backflow RPZ Testing

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                            • #15
                              Re: Josam Stainless Steel Floor Sink Liner

                              ron, would a spot repair/ fiberglass liner inserted down the sink tailpiece have worked too?

                              rick.
                              phoebe it is

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