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"The Great Propress debate"

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  • #31
    Re: "The Great Propress debate"

    Well the high price does somewhat keep the average diy hack from getting into the game. The reason the machine is so expensive though is that the market is really limited. The sales are not high enough to bring the price down. The real problem is that Pro-Press is pretty much exclusively used for repair work. Almost nobody is going to use it for an entire piping job for a couple of reasons like the price of copper for one and the price of Pro-Press fittings for two. Most are going to forge ahead with our other nemesis, PEX because it's faster, cheaper and even easier than pressing copper is. The real hard truth is that copper has pretty much priced itself out of the market and that of course effects the sale of pro-press tools and fittings. Honestly, I have two press machines. They sit on the tool crib shelf 99% of the time. Every once in awhile someone remembers we have them and drags it out for a repair but, I have 13 service vans on the road and stocking all of them with machine, jaws and fittings would be a huge expense that would never get paid down. I guess that if I was a one man rodeo and was swamped with work, I might use it a bit more often for quick repairs.
    Last edited by NHMaster3015; 06-02-2012, 12:11 PM.
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    • #32
      Re: "The Great Propress debate"

      Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
      Well the high price does somewhat keep the average diy hack from getting into the game. The reason the machine is so expensive though is that the market is really limited. The sales are not high enough to bring the price down. The real problem is that Pro-Press is pretty much exclusively used for repair work. Almost nobody is going to use it for an entire piping job for a couple of reasons like the price of copper for one and the price of Pro-Press fittings for two. Most are going to forge ahead with our other nemesis, PEX because it's faster, cheaper and even easier than pressing copper is. The real hard truth is that copper has pretty much priced itself out of the market and that of course effects the sale of pro-press tools and fittings. Honestly, I have two press machines. They sit on the tool crib shelf 99% of the time. Every once in awhile someone remembers we have them and drags it out for a repair but, I have 13 service vans on the road and stocking all of them with machine, jaws and fittings would be a huge expense that would never get paid down. I guess that if I was a one man rodeo and was swamped with work, I might use it a bit more often for quick repairs.
      Yes I get that line of thinking for plumbers but I'm sure the people making the tool don't care - they are just in the game of making money on the tool and fittings. I'm sure it is based on some form of market analysis as you say. You are correct about the price of copper - just bought a bunch of pipes and fittings for my latest project and was quite surprised at the total bill (and this was just for sweat fittings).

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      • #33
        Re: "The Great Propress debate"

        "And your reasoning for record profits, is because you are screwing your customer."

        Because we use Propress we're screwing our customers? It's really sad you would even say such a thing to the thousands of professional plumbers who use Propress.

        I don't know about you but I'm in business to make money and to show as much profit as I possibly can and I'll charge at the top end of what my market allows. I've earned the right to charge as a professional no matter what materials or tools I decide to use. If I can find ways to better myself and my business to be more proficient and be more profitable I'll use those tools if I find they meet my criteria and Propress certainly does just that.

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        • #34
          Re: "The Great Propress debate"

          We'll see where Propress stands when 4" Sharkbites enter the picture !

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          • #35
            Re: "The Great Propress debate"

            Okie; The plumbing unions were dead set on not allowing PVC to come to market and in some states there are still some hefty restrictions on it's use but alas, money always wins the day and when you get enough manufacturers and lobbyists out there greasing palms it's not long before code review boards start changing their minds. That and the inability of our own PHCC to hold the line have lead to the continual degradation of our trade and the materials used. I understand completely that many plumbers out there have to change with the times or close their doors. Starting and running a plumbing company has always been a damn if you do and damned if you don't business. I know things change and some things should change but I ask again. As a master plumber, responsible for education your apprentice. What are you teaching him?
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            • #36
              Re: "The Great Propress debate"

              Originally posted by ironranger View Post
              "And your reasoning for record profits, is because you are screwing your customer."

              Because we use Propress we're screwing our customers? It's really sad you would even say such a thing to the thousands of professional plumbers who use Propress.

              I don't know about you but I'm in business to make money and to show as much profit as I possibly can and I'll charge at the top end of what my market allows. I've earned the right to charge as a professional no matter what materials or tools I decide to use. If I can find ways to better myself and my business to be more proficient and be more profitable I'll use those tools if I find they meet my criteria and Propress certainly does just that.
              I don't know about that "thousands" thing. Might be interesting to do a poll and see how many of us are actually using it regularly.
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              • #37
                Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                I don't know about that "thousands" thing. Might be interesting to do a poll and see how many of us are actually using it regularly.
                How many have been sold? That will give us the answer. Can someone from Ridgid chime in? And then how many Rothenbergers, etc.?

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                • #38
                  Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                  I did some repair & remodel plumbing work, a few years back, for an out of town co, that does renovations, mostly on franchise style restaurants. They owned their own propress machine, & had a whole grocery cart full of propress ftgs. They were not shy about telling me they do their own plumbing work, most of the time. Only reason they needed me, was cuz they had to get permits. I could tell they had done some of the work, on a 1" copper water line, before I got there, but could not prove it for sure.

                  Only reason I did any work for this co, was the electrician is a good friend of mine. Mostly all their work, is done after the restaurants close at night, so they probably get away without permits, most of the time.

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                  • #39
                    Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                    Originally posted by ironranger View Post
                    How many have been sold? That will give us the answer. Can someone from Ridgid chime in? And then how many Rothenbergers, etc.?
                    That wouldn't be accurate. Every shop I was at that had one, it sat on the shelf.

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                    • #40
                      Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                      Yea, it can't be gross sales. I have two and hardly ever use them and I know a few other plumbers around here say the same thing.
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                      • #41
                        Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                        This debate is starting to get a little silly. Do whatever works for you and makes you happy and wealthy. Have a great weekend everyone, I'm going fishing.

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                        • #42
                          Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                          It's raining hard here. sposed to till Tuesday. No fishing this weekend.....sucks. Last weekend was unbelievable fishing. 4 good fish on the first 4 casts
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                          • #43
                            Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                            Here we go again lol
                            Will Rogers Plumbing
                            Moore, Oklahoma
                            (
                            405) 323-2852

                            "Your Solution for Any Sewer and Drain Cleaning Needs"

                            "We Unclog Drains That Others Can't"



                            www.willrogersplumbing.com
                            http://willrogersplumbing.com/?page_id=8

                            "Oklahoma's Favorite Plumbers!"

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                            • #44
                              Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                              Originally posted by NHMaster3015 View Post
                              Yea, it can't be gross sales. I have two and hardly ever use them and I know a few other plumbers around here say the same thing.
                              Just curious, why did you buy one in the first place if its dumbing down the trade?
                              26+6=1

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                              • #45
                                Re: "The Great Propress debate"

                                ......again? Ok, again.

                                The propress has its place. I'd love to have one for repairs. If I spent the money on the press, it's all I'd use, just to feel justified in the expense. I can currently rent one for $17 a day. So when the repair dictates I can grab one and go. Otherwise, I'm sticking with my B-tank.
                                No, it's not rocket science, it's plumbing and unlike rocket science it requires a license.

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