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  • Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

    Hi:

    Here's one for you. My TS3650 will only tilt about 5-8 degrees and then starts to bind. I checked all the normal culprits (sawdust on the turn screw, retainer bearings, made sure the tilt lock handle was loose, etc). All of those things are OK. I took the table insert out and examined the way the saw moves in the trunions as it tilts (as I slowly turn the tilt handle). Too my great surprise and disappointment, as the saw is tilting it is literally shaving very thin slithers out of the trunions (the tracks it pivots in). It is doing this to both front and back trunions (front just a bit more than the back). So, once it gets up to a point where the gouge it too great, it stops.

    What gives?? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

    Little background. The saw is basically new. As I assembled it, set it up, etc., it tilted fine. The saw did not need that much adustment from the factory. Did not even have to mess with the trunions.

    However, as I got into a cabinet making project, I noticed the saw blade was no longer parallel to the miter gauage. I then adjusted the trunions, per the manual. Will note here, it appears the trunion bolts were fairly loose from the factory. I assume this is why the saw moved from its original settings.

    Any way, I squared it back up, run it through the tilt check, etc...no problems. Then today, I wanted to do a 45 degree cut and no joy.

    What say the experts here?

    Thanks

    Dan

  • #2
    Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

    Dan
    The trunions have to be parallel to each other and in the same plane along with adjusted so the blade remains parallel.

    Since you adjusted the trunions I suspect they are either not parallel with each other or the are not in the same plane.

    Perfectly setup
    trunion blade truion
    |----------___-------|

    ____________________________ Fence


    Trunion not parallel to each other
    trunion blade trunion
    |---------_____--------\

    ___________________________ Fence

    Trunion not in same plane

    |----------______ _ _ _ _ _ _|

    ______________________________ Fence

    To find our loosen all the bolt in the rear trunion but the center one. Loosen it just a tiny bit. Now try cranking in bevel while watching the trunion does it move? If so get under the saw and measure the distance between the trunions at both ends. And also measure the end of the trunion closest to the fence is the same distance as the other from the side of the blade slot.

    I will bet what you did when you adjusted the blade to be parallel with the fence is moved the rear trunion out of parallel with the front trunion or you shifted the whole trunion over so it is closer to one side of saw than the other trunion is.
    Rev Ed

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

      Rev Ed:

      Upfront, many thanks for the reply. The one and only after a couple of days. Have to say, I kinda doubted what you suggested--don't take that wrong...just didn't make sense that they would design a saw where the trunions have to be measured against one another (even after you have the saw blade parallel to the miter track. I figured the manual would have stated this procedure you recommended.

      However, out of desperation, I attempted as you suggested. I loosened everything up and readjusted the truions, tighened everything back down and same problem. I did it two more times and each time...same problem. It still cuts slithers from the trunion tracks as the saw is tilted.

      Today, I took the saw down and carried it back to HD and got a refund. Very disappointed at this point.

      However, as I started out, I appreciate your response.

      All the best.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

        Originally posted by DB06 View Post
        Rev Ed:

        Upfront, many thanks for the reply. The one and only after a couple of days. Have to say, I kinda doubted what you suggested--don't take that wrong...just didn't make sense that they would design a saw where the trunions have to be measured against one another (even after you have the saw blade parallel to the miter track. I figured the manual would have stated this procedure you recommended.

        However, out of desperation, I attempted as you suggested. I loosened everything up and readjusted the truions, tighened everything back down and same problem. I did it two more times and each time...same problem. It still cuts slithers from the trunion tracks as the saw is tilted.

        Today, I took the saw down and carried it back to HD and got a refund. Very disappointed at this point.

        However, as I started out, I appreciate your response.

        All the best.

        Dan
        Wow I'm sitting here with egg on my face.

        Frankly I don't understand it. The problem started when you adjusted the trunions and only misalignment would cause it to gouge rather than slide.

        I would love to see what is really wrong I suspect the two trunions are not parallel to each other. As you cranked in bevel the casting between them ran out of room began to shave off slivers and eventually got so tight you couldn't move it.

        Tell me when you have the trunions loose did you try to crank the blade over in bevel? I would think that would have forced the trunions apart and solved the problem.

        You said you took the saw back. Did you replace it with another 3650? If so check the tightness of the trunion bolts and tighten them now before they can slip. If you go to another saw know that all saws have trunions and all saws are susceptible to the same problem.
        Rev Ed

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

          Rev Ed

          No, I did not get a replacement Rigid Saw. I am back into the research mode again and will look for another brand this time.

          In my mind, the saw was defective. When I loosened the trunions, I did tilt the saw to 45 degrees....at first it was a little tight, but then it worked itself loose or "back in alignment perhaps" and did not gouge the tracks. However, when everything was square and tightened back down, it did the same thing repeatedly...bind up and cut slithers of metal from the trunion tracks when tilted for a cut.

          I understand what your are saying and applied your tech...just did not work. However, with respect to your observation....I still do not understand how when the saw blade is dead parrallel to the miter track the trunions can be so off that this could happen. And, if in fact this could happen, then all owners of Rigid Table Saws could potentially run into this problem---and I don't think I have seen this particular problem mentioned on the forums. In the manual, it says nothing about ensuring the trunions themselves are parallel to each other. Only that the blade is parallel to the track.

          Understand that all table saws have truions, however...I hope they are not all designed so that it takes 4 to 6 different sets of measurements (some under the table in hard to get to areas) just to square the blade--if what you are suggesting is accurate.

          Like I said earlier, perhaps this was just a bad saw from the factory and something was not milled exactly right. Overall, I could see how this saw has potential (after all, it does come highly recommended and many folks are pleased with it). I just am not taking another chance on Rigid right now.

          May have to up my price range and look at something different.

          DB

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

            Well, if you decide to increase your price ceiling think about a hybrid or cabinet saw, especially if you don't plan on moving it around much.
            ---------------
            Light is faster than sound. That's why some people seem really bright until you hear them speak.
            ---------------
            “If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber.” - Albert Einstein
            ---------
            "Its a table saw.... Do you know where your fingers are?"
            ---------
            sigpic http://www.helmetstohardhats.com/

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

              Originally posted by DB06 View Post
              Rev Ed

              No, I did not get a replacement Rigid Saw. I am back into the research mode again and will look for another brand this time.

              In my mind, the saw was defective. When I loosened the trunions, I did tilt the saw to 45 degrees....at first it was a little tight, but then it worked itself loose or "back in alignment perhaps" and did not gouge the tracks. However, when everything was square and tightened back down, it did the same thing repeatedly...bind up and cut slithers of metal from the trunion tracks when tilted for a cut.

              I understand what your are saying and applied your tech...just did not work. However, with respect to your observation....I still do not understand how when the saw blade is dead parrallel to the miter track the trunions can be so off that this could happen. And, if in fact this could happen, then all owners of Rigid Table Saws could potentially run into this problem---and I don't think I have seen this particular problem mentioned on the forums. In the manual, it says nothing about ensuring the trunions themselves are parallel to each other. Only that the blade is parallel to the track.

              Understand that all table saws have truions, however...I hope they are not all designed so that it takes 4 to 6 different sets of measurements (some under the table in hard to get to areas) just to square the blade--if what you are suggesting is accurate.

              Like I said earlier, perhaps this was just a bad saw from the factory and something was not milled exactly right. Overall, I could see how this saw has potential (after all, it does come highly recommended and many folks are pleased with it). I just am not taking another chance on Rigid right now.

              May have to up my price range and look at something different.

              DB
              DB
              All saws are open to this potential but it has to be a very serious misalignment to cause the gouging. Most users never check their parallelism with the blade tilted and useless it is out a lot it is mostly unnoticable.

              If you read practically any major saw book the author will eventually mention that once you have your saw in perfect alignment you shouldn't tilt the blade but rather build a jig to cut a bevel. In times gone by high priced saws of furniture building quality had fixed arbors and tilting tables.

              However with new machining and materials tilting the blade to cut bevels is generally accepted. Norm does it all the time and he is on TV so it has to be okay, right?

              I really believe something else must have been wrong with your saw, however it seems very odd the problem only occurred after you moved the trunion in the first place.

              Personally I think the Ridgid 3650 is the biggest bang for the buck and it is simply ludicrous to spend the money buying a production saw (commonly called cabinet saws) for the home hobbiest. There is absolutely no increase in accuracy or anything else unless you use your saw 24/7 to cut anything you can get on the table.

              Rather than spending more money give Ridgid another shot only this time check those trunion bolts to insure they are tight from the factory.
              Rev Ed

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

                Well Rev Ed:

                Been doing some research online for table saws. The General International contractor saw has spiked my interest. There is a jet and dewalt model that also draw my attention, but leaning towards the General right now. I am with you, can't see dropping down 2 K for a PM or other high end cabinet saw, if I did this full time, that would be a different story. However, there are other contractor saws out there that "appear" worth the extra couple hundred. Still reading at this point.

                Not keen on the Rigid 3650 any more, been reading more reviews on it with my research (rigid pops up here and there when your reading opinions, etc) and I don't appear to be the only one that had alignment problems.

                Thanks for the input Rev Ed.

                Dan

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Blade Tilt Problem on TS3650

                  i had the same problen with it shaving metal.it was an alignment problem.

                  Comment

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