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  • DeWalt won me back

    I now have a total of 9 DeWalt batteries, some work and some don't.

    I called DeWalt about a month ago to ask about warrantee on 2 XRP batteries that are not doing good, one is stone dead, the other won't hold more than 4 days. Both are just over 2 years old. Their reply, short and sweet, 90 days, thanks for calling!
    Well, that sucked!!!

    Today, I wanted to figure out the date code on them so I called the DW service center here and the guy told me how to figure the code out. I told him my story on all my batteries and the 2 giving me problems. He told me the XRP have a 2 year warrantee but mine were out of warrantee. We chatted a little and he, out of the blue, said, "bring em in and i'll give you 2 new XRP batteries"! Wow, blew me away. I guess he figured if I had 9 batteries that I also had spent a few grand on tools that they go to. He apparently figured it was better to keep me as a happy customer and a good referrer than to blow me off. So, next week i'm making the trip across town for 2 new batteries.

    Mark

  • #2
    Re: DeWalt won me back

    i have dewalt and i had about 7 batteries at one time and the oldest one was 5 yrs old and never had a problem with them . t i try not to have 4 at a time so they don't go bad from not using them ,and i use and charge them each 1 time a day .they are 2 -2yrs old 2- 4yrs old .
    i have gotten an average of 5yrs a batterie, so i think thats good.

    and cangrads on your new ones
    Charlie

    My seek the peek fundraiser page
    http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


    http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

    new work pictures 12/09
    http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: DeWalt won me back

      Thanks.
      I'm pretty jazzed about it too. I made a charging station today, 4 chargers all wired together to save my outlet! LOL Going to flip the breaker at night so they are all off but let them set in the "tune up" charger during the daytime. The guy from DW said that was a good thing to do and will not harm them.

      Mark

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      • #4
        Re: DeWalt won me back

        i thought it was not good to keep them I'm the charger when it was not on ?
        Charlie

        My seek the peek fundraiser page
        http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


        http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

        new work pictures 12/09
        http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: DeWalt won me back

          Good thought. I'll ask them when I go down. Never thought of that aspect. Maybe the charger will pull them down? Hmmmm.


          Mark

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          • #6
            Re: DeWalt won me back

            all i can say is


            LUCKY!!!!!!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: DeWalt won me back

              Originally posted by J-man12 View Post
              all i can say is


              LUCKY????? Why is he LUCKY?

              as far as the leaving them on the charger, it's OK to do with the yellow ones.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: DeWalt won me back

                Milwaukee once replaced a 18v ni cad that was 2 years old(there warrantee is 1 year) cause they knew therir 18v batteries were troublesome.
                You can never have enough drills-too many is just enough!!!!!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: DeWalt won me back

                  Originally posted by donutboy View Post
                  as far as the leaving them on the charger, it's OK to do with the yellow ones.
                  for how long can you do this ?
                  Charlie

                  My seek the peek fundraiser page
                  http://observatory.mountwashington.o...nal&fr_id=1040


                  http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php

                  new work pictures 12/09
                  http://public.fotki.com/hvachawk/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: DeWalt won me back

                    Originally posted by Jmark View Post
                    Thanks.
                    I'm pretty jazzed about it too. I made a charging station today, 4 chargers all wired together to save my outlet! LOL Going to flip the breaker at night so they are all off but let them set in the "tune up" charger during the daytime. The guy from DW said that was a good thing to do and will not harm them.

                    Mark
                    Over charging and reduced cycle life is somthing you might want to consider when shutting off those chargers every night and then turning them back on with fully charged batteries still in them the next day.
                    The dewalt chargers like many other nicad chargers sense full charge by recording the peak battery voltage achieved by the charging current, then the charger maintains this current until the voltage starts to drop due to heating of the battery, (which means it's fully charged), then after the voltage drops a certain amount (usually about .1 of a volt ) the charger shuts off the main charging current and switches over to the maintainence charge which is a non memory forming, high frequency pulsed charging current which helps inhibit the growth of crystals on the cell plates (which reduce capacity and increase the rate of self discharge and if the crystals grow large enough actually short the cell internally).
                    Each time you shut the power off and then back on to the chargers with the batteries still in them, the charger does'nt know that the batteries are fully charged so the charger goes through the complete charge cycle all over again just to replace the charge the batteries lost over night due to self discharge. This results in unneccesary heating and over charging of the battery just to get the battery back to the state it was in before you killed the power the night before. This will shorten the battery life by adding an additional and unneccesary charge cycle (partial discharge, charge, overcharge and maintenence charge) to the batteries.
                    My suggestion to you is to leave them on charge when not in use and don't shut the power off to the chargers. If you have more batteries than chargers rotate them out using the batteries on the charger first and charging the dead ones as you use the charged ones.
                    If you take the charged ones off of charge just to charge the dead ones and you don't use the charged ones till the next day you will only get about 80 percent capacity if the charged battery has sat a day and 70 percent capacity the day after that (due to the high self discharge rate of nicads, which get exceedingly worse with age). Also don't over discharge the batteries by running the tool until it's dead, this results in cell polarity reversal which is bad for the cells. As soon as the tool starts to lose power it means that the weakest cells in the battery have just died while the strong cells continue to deliver power, seeing that the cells are in series this results in polarity reversal of the weakest cells. Hope you find this info usefull.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: DeWalt won me back

                      Steve....

                      Great info, thanks. I just hate leaving them on the charger all the time. Guess i'm afraid of a fire. I'll take them out at night and then do as the guy at DW suggested. He said if they are not going to be used for a week or so, to drop them back in the charger every 4 or 5 days to keep them up. He also said to NOT run them dead, like you warned about. Once you notice a drop in rpm, to put them in the charger. He also said the leaving them in the charger (plugged in!) is ok too.

                      I went to the DW store yesterday and took in ALL my old batteries and 3 of my 4 XRP's. I checked my other 18v and it had gone dead after sitting for 3 days! Personally, a 75% failure rate does not speak to highly of the "new and improved" XRP batteries.

                      I put all of them on the counter and the guy saw my black marker date on them and said "you bought them when"???? I had to refresh his memory on our conversation. HE was the one who offered the free ones! LOL I didn't ask for them. Anyway, he went back to the store room and came out with 2 new 18v XRP's and one 14.4v XRP. Handed them to me and told me to have a nice day. Great guy! I would have been happy with the old black top XR2 batteries, but he said they did not carry them in the store anymore. I too have some that are 5 years old and still working. Just not sold on the new XRP line.

                      One guy next to me had a big box of DW stuff. 3 18v drills beat to death, in for repairs. One 18v right angle drill, again, beat to death, in for repairs. Then he lined up EIGHT, 18v XRP batteries on the counter and said all of them were bad! The guy said "OK" and checked in the drills and replaced all 8 batteries! Crap!!! I"d be pretty upset if I had 8 of them go bad!

                      But I want away happy, having saved about $170 on batteries.
                      Last edited by Jmark; 06-07-2007, 02:19 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: DeWalt won me back

                        Originally posted by Steve Klyce View Post
                        The dewalt chargers like many other nicad chargers sense full charge by recording the peak battery voltage achieved by the charging current, then the charger maintains this current until the voltage starts to drop due to heating of the battery, (which means it's fully charged), then after the voltage drops a certain amount (usually about .1 of a volt ) the charger shuts off the main charging current and switches over to the maintainence charge which is a non memory forming, high frequency pulsed charging current which helps inhibit the growth of crystals on the cell plates (which reduce capacity and increase the rate of self discharge and if the crystals grow large enough actually short the cell internally).
                        What you describe is a "Peak Voltage Detection" charger. These are common in RC cars and the cheapest ones start about $50. They are the most accurate way to fill a battery...but not always the most reliable. They sometimes can miss the peak and overcharge...or see a "false peak" and undercharge. This is very rare with the more expensive ones.

                        I was told and read in several different sources, that nearly all tool chargers use simple temperature measurement as a cutoff. The temperature measurement, while not as accurate, and affected by using the battery or the ambient temperatures....will not overcharge above a temperature. The compromise is you always heat up the battery at least that much, and charging the battery in hot conditions yields an incomplete charge.

                        Originally posted by Steve Klyce View Post
                        Each time you shut the power off and then back on to the chargers with the batteries still in them, the charger does'nt know that the batteries are fully charged so the charger goes through the complete charge cycle all over again just to replace the charge the batteries lost over night due to self discharge. This results in unneccesary heating and over charging of the battery just to get the battery back to the state it was in before you killed the power the night before. This will shorten the battery life by adding an additional and unneccesary charge cycle (partial discharge, charge, overcharge and maintenence charge) to the batteries.
                        With the temperature measurement it is even worse because when you stick the freshly charged and freshly cooled battery into the charger it will hard charge it again...until it reaches the high temperature cutoff. Each time you take it out and in you heat cycle it. Heat is a major factor in battery life.

                        Limiting heat exposure, in general will improve battery life. Store them in a cool place. Never leave them locked up in a 120 degree car. Keep them out of the sun. Let them fully cool before recharging. All these things will extend their life.

                        Originally posted by Steve Klyce View Post
                        My suggestion to you is to leave them on charge when not in use and don't shut the power off to the chargers. If you have more batteries than chargers rotate them out using the batteries on the charger first and charging the dead ones as you use the charged ones.
                        While I think this might be better than letting the batteries go too low and reversing on themselves, it keeps them warm...which will greatly shorten their life. You are better off leaving the batteries in a cool place and occasionally charging them....not even fully....say for 20 minutes, if it normally takes an hour for a full charge.

                        A maintenance charger could be fashioned but most tool chargers do a very poor job of maintenance charging. They usually just apply a low DC current which is not the best thing for the battery in the long run, but does make it convenient for the user.

                        What RC people do, is short each individual cell to zero and store them like that. Then they slow charge them back to full power...which insures equal charge across cells. This isn't something a tool user is going to be able to do without modification, electrical soldering skills and a great amount of time.

                        Originally posted by Steve Klyce View Post
                        If you take the charged ones off of charge just to charge the dead ones and you don't use the charged ones till the next day you will only get about 80 percent capacity if the charged battery has sat a day and 70 percent capacity the day after that (due to the high self discharge rate of nicads, which get exceedingly worse with age).
                        The self discharge rate is greatly affected by temperature. If you keep your batteries cool it will be much lower. Some sources recommend keeping batteries refrigerated to slow down the rate. They should be allowed to warm up before use because they are very inefficient at these lower temperatures.

                        Originally posted by Steve Klyce View Post
                        Also don't over discharge the batteries by running the tool until it's dead, this results in cell polarity reversal which is bad for the cells. As soon as the tool starts to lose power it means that the weakest cells in the battery have just died while the strong cells continue to deliver power, seeing that the cells are in series this results in polarity reversal of the weakest cells. Hope you find this info usefull.
                        Running individual cells flat is one method to "exercise" them and it helps avoid crystal formation. In multi-cell packs, like tool batteries it is a very dangerous thing to do. Because the cells get "out of synch" some will have more charge than others...especially as the pack ages. If you drive a pack down too low when there is too great a difference between the individual cells a cell will reverse. The other cells will drive it to a reverse voltage and it will be destroyed quickly.
                        Last edited by Disaster; 06-08-2007, 07:57 AM.

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