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  • Milwaukee 3/8" corded

    I read somewhere (in this forum I believe) that the newer corded Milwaukee products are not as good (or reliable or as well built) as the older products. I want to acquire a 3/8" Milwaukee 0200-20 drill but how can I tell the older (presumably better) products from the newer products? (I want a keyed chuck as I have never seen a keyless chuck worth having).

    Also, if anyone has a Milwaukee 0200-20 what is the minimum bit size that the chuck will take? I called 3 stores and they do not know and the Milwaukee website does not say.

    Reason for my question: I have a 1/2" & a 1/4" Mag. Milwaukee and I love them and I want to get a very good 3/8" Milwaukee while I can, if I still can.

    Thanks

  • #2
    Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

    While not made anymore a great 3/8" Milwaukee drill was the Magnum version of the current 0234. If I remember it was the 0222-1 which came setup to run about 1000-1200 RPM no load and had a super Jacobs industrial chuck on it. The newer 8 Amp drills are just too darn heavy among other things and their side handle is a love-hate item. The current semi Magnum 0200-20 is very nose heavy and thus painful to use at times. You might want to look at other brands besides Milwaukee. Please do NOT buy the 0233 unless you want high speed over torque and are willing to replace the nasty keyless chuck. Normally a keyed 3/8 chuck can hold under a 1/16" shank but not all of them will. The 0222-1 (back when made) and the current 0200 have 1/2-20 spindles and this is great news as you can get some very nice aftermarket checks if necessary.

    You may want to have a look at the Makita 6402 or Dewalt DW223G.

    If you can find a Milwaukee 0222 with the metal gear case that would be a very good one for you to think about.

    By the way what is the smallest size twist drill you want the chuck to be able to hold? I may have some ideas of which chucks would work out for you. Also, what speed (no load) would you like? Are you wanting a 3/8 drill that's more like a 1/4 high speed model or more like a 1/2 that happens to run a little faster and weigh a bit less?
    Last edited by Woussko; 09-17-2007, 09:30 PM.

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    • #3
      Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

      I think that thread was talking about the quality of the Milwaukee line now that they have been bought out and manufacturing moved overseas. I have a couple of the older Milwaukee drills and a router and I would not trade them for anything from their current line. If one of them dies and they offer me a free replacement I would sell it on eBay NIB and use the money to buy an old Made in the USA model.

      It's not that I don't have some handheld power tools that are foreign made, its that most don't compare (to me anyway) to what Milwaukee and others made here and it saddens me that we have contributed to manufacturers moving overseas to produce their goods. Contributed not caused mind you.

      Boy is that statement a can of worms that needs opening or what?

      Everyone wants their products cheaper and at the same time the stockholders want maximum dividends, something in the middle has got to give. Well the only things in the middle are quality, durability, labor wages & benefits, and the costs of materials, R&D, product testing, and marketing.

      Quality - there are a number of ways to save money by twiddling with quality, I think you know where they all lead.

      Durability - related to quality but it has its own set of parameters. The product can perform perfectly and drop dead right at the end of its useful life. Oh, that sounds somewhat like that lifetime warranty fish story that they are always selling (it's not RIDGID I'm picking on here, ALL manufacturers across the board). That duration can be engineered to be one month or ten years depending on the materials used and other parameters.

      Wages & Benefits - Usually one of the first to go when reducing production costs or looking to increase profits margins. A little creative accounting can make that pension fund look fatter than it is and justify skimming a little cream off the top to pay out big bonuses and/or dividends.

      Raw materials - Who care if there's a little extra lead in the paint right? No one will know (or knows) how long we have been using lead in our paints. Makes those gears out of pot metal instead of steel, they'll hold up till after the warranty is off.

      R&D - We don't need no stinking R&D, I don't have to do my own R&D to make it. We can steal the ideas of other companies, and if they don't want to share or make it too tough for use to figure out or compete we can petition the courts to force them to share their hard work with us (such as Microsoft being forced to share code with others).

      Testing - Let the consumer be our test lab. When we get enough complaints we can implement corrective actions and appear responsive to the consumer's plight. It's much cheaper than testing before we release those kids toys with magnets that detach or lead paint on them or contaminated food products.

      Marketing - we can't cut marketing, we are gonna need all the advertising we can buy to get people to buy out products now that they are made overseas by semi-skilled workers in deplorable working conditions with next to no pay and zero bennies while they breath toxic fumes or are exposed to who knows what bacteria, virus, or disease.


      Now that the average Joe has some control over his future (read pension or retirement money) he wants to maximize his return right. Sure he does, who wouldn't? So he checks his stocks and funds regularly and when one is just the slightest bit off he moves to another that pays a couple percentage points more per quarter. Only his move takes a day or two to complete and by then the slight dip that causes his wallet to cry out in pain has corrected itself and is back to normal. Meanwhile the new stock or fund that has caught his eye has taken a downturn or maybe is doing OK. The big shots at the first stock are wondering why everyone jumped ship and they see that its due to the downturn or a dividend that is less than last years (but still respectable). So they take actions to ensure profits margins remain high, and that's where the actions above come into play. They start looking for where to cut expenses to increase profits, and don't forget that employees are an expense nothing more to most companies. Today's worker is nothing more than a necessary tool needed to reach an end goal to many companies. When they cost too much or squeak too loud they can be replaced with others.

      Sound bitter don't I. Well you would be right. I've watched big business and the fat politicians in our federal and state governments destroy all that was good with this country over the past 30 years or so.

      The number of union workers is down roughly to half what it was 30 years ago, and the average workers real buying power has remained stagnant for almost that same time. Sure the wage rate has gone up a little here and there, and peoples total income has increased, but that's because they are working two lower wage jobs to have enough to feed and house their families compared to what they made 25 years ago. How is it that in the 50s and 60s and into the 70s most mothers could stay at home and now over half work over 30 hours a week just to put the same food on the table and clothes on the backs of their kids and what have you. How can medical costs rise to be near triple (in real dollars) what they were 15 or 20 years ago and wages remain so low?

      How come in the decades past when a hurricane came roaring through the Gulf the price of gas remained the same and now as soon as they give a hurricane a name the price of gas jumps? Why is that? How come when winter rolls around the price of heating oil jumps when its cheaper to make heating oil than gas and they have been making it all year anyway. Its not as big deal to switch over from producing gasoline to heating oil as they lead you to believe. Punch a couple buttons on the computer in the control room and send a couple operators out to position some valves and you're making money.

      Why is it that when a scheduled shutdown comes now their capacity is reduced and they have to charge us extra for fuel they made two months ago?

      Now that hybrid technology vehicles have been put out by all the manufacturers for a number of years why do they claim it will take them until 2012 to produce hybrid models across their model line? Do some of them have better technology than the others? Maybe they should follow the path of Netscape and others and cry to Uncle Sam to force those with better engineering to share their secrets so everyone can play as they did to Microsoft (I don't necessarily agree with all of Microsoft's business decisions, but I do think they should not be forced to share their technology with others, let the whiners build their own OS and market it with whatever features they wish). I say that by Jan. 1, 2010 90% of all vehicles should be hybrids or fuel cell or some other similar technology. Vehicles over 10K Lb GCW would be expemt but face strick emmisions standards nationwide comparable to CA or NJ. If a current model line of cars can not be converted over to hybrid technology by that date well then tehy will just have to stop production until it is.

      Gasahol or bio-fuels are not the answer . Did you hear what happened in Italy last week? They (consumers nationwide) boycotted pasta products. This in a county where the average Italian concumes 60 to 70 pounds of pasta a year. They protested the fact that prices went up 75% in one year because the prices paid for grains to produce bio-fuels are diverting food from the table to the pump. What makes anyone think the same thing won't happen here?

      Gosh, I didn't even get a word in about the price of health care or drugs.

      Well, I've rambeled on enough for tonight.
      "When we build let us think we build forever. Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone. Let it be such work that our descendants will thank us for, and let us think, as we lay stone upon stone, that a time is to come when these stones will be held sacred because our hands have touched them, and that men will say, as they look upon the labor and wrought substance of them, "See! This our fathers did for us."
      John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

        the o200-20 is ,well not that good.now the o233-20 is a mag,3/8 but has a keyless chuck.you might want to check on a different brand or buy the 0233-20 and buy a keyed chuck to put on and you will be happy with it.
        A fishing pole is the best cordless tool!

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        • #5
          Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

          Thank you Woussko for your reply!

          I would probably only need a 3/8" chuck drill with a 0-1200 speed as I have a Milwaukee 0124-1 (0-2000 RPM). It has a Jacobs 7BA (0-1/4").

          My current 3/8" is a B&D professional #1166 (4 amp/0-2500). One of it's limitations is its poor quality Jacobs chuck (22BA, 1/16"-3/8').

          My dislike of keyless chucks stems from my use of my Makita 6213D (12V). It has a Jacobs Hand-Tite chuck that is pure garbage. Maybe they are better today, but I hate to make another expensive mistake.

          I really like the Jacobs Professional Keyed chucks like the 7BA. I have not seen the Jacobs 32BA (0-3/8") but I am guessing that it is of similiar quality to the 7BA and it is also a 1/2-20 which would fit the Milwaukee drill.

          When did Milwaukee quit making the 0222-1? Is the Makita 6402 or the Dewalt DW223G Just as good in your opinion?

          Thanks again

          Alan

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

            If you like your B&D drill other than the chuck, how about replacing the 22BA-3/8 with say a 41BA-3/8 chuck? A lower cost and still pretty good chuck would be a Rohm 666574 which is 1/32-3/8 inch and a 3/8-24 mount. Trying to find them is a little tuff, but they are out there.

            I think the Milwaukee 0222 is going to be hard to come by in good condition. Time flies and it may have been dropped over 20 years ago. It's the same as the 0234 other than the gearing and chuck.

            As for the Dewalt and Makita, they are different and while I like Milwaukee, they aren't bad tools. The Milwaukee 0233 is a high speed 3/8 drill with a max no load speed of 2800 RPM. I had one to try in the spring. It feels nice and runs well, but has limited torque. I totally hated the keyless chuck on it so I swapped it with a Jacobs 41BA-3/8 to try it more. It is a shame that anymore companies go ape with motors on 1/4 and 3/8 drills. The old 0222 would have been a very nice choice based on what I think you want in a 3/8 drill.

            I personally have and like a slightly modified Black & Decker Profressional model 1175 but again it's got to be 25 or older now. The 3/8 Milwaukee (have to find model) made just before the Magnum series came out was very nice. I'm thinking it may have been a 0102 but that's a guess. I'll try to find more on it soon. At one time Milwaukee had a nice 1/4" version of the 0234 as well. I really think they blew it and went wild for the Tim Allen "More Power" and forgot that we aren't looking for a high speed 1/2" drill just geared for a higher spindle speed. We want to be able to hold it and not have it so heavy.

            Now you have me wondering what I would buy if in the market for a new 3/8" VSR Pistol Grip drill for my own needs. I'll try to check out the Makita and Dewalt models I mentioned earlier.

            If you like your B & D, I would keep it and change the chuck for now. You can remove it and install it on a new drill as long as the spindle is the same size.

            By the way if you hate the 22BA chuck you need to play with cheapo home owner keyed Jacobs (and other) chucks. There's some very sad stuff out there.
            Last edited by Woussko; 09-17-2007, 10:36 PM.

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            • #7
              Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

              Jacobs 32BA Chuck

              This is a big size 3/8 chuck that's much like the 33BA other than for capacity. I think on a 3/8 drill it may be too much and lead to the nose end becoming too heavy on you. Try (as much as you can) to actually hold a drill for several minutes and see how it feels. That is one thing I tend to like with a good many Mikita drills. They just feel nice in my hands. As to the quality, I don't think they are bad, but I doubt you'll find any drills made better than the Milwaukee Magnum other than a few very costly ones from Gemany that are hard to obtain and most I have seen are really a 1/2" 2 or 3 speed (gears shift) models. They get heavy to hold quickly. As for the Dewalt if nothing else you should be able to get parts for it easy enough. I haven't actually seen that model, but was going by what they have on their web site. I think it would be an OK tool, but I still like the older Milwaukee better.

              I would like to see the day when we have the Old Milwaukee Electric Tool Corp again and have it all owned by USA stockholders that are serious about power tools. I doubt I'll live long enough.


              *&^%$#@%&*(&^% you TTI you (*^%#$# hog

              The attached file is on Jacobs Professional Chucks and it gives lots of good info about them. I suggest everyone please download and print it out.
              Attached Files
              Last edited by Woussko; 09-17-2007, 10:58 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                Quick question

                Which 1/2 inch Milwaukee do you have?

                If you can find one in mint condition the 75th anniversary edition of the 0234 is one nice drill to have. It comes with a very nice steel case too. The box it come in will be 0236-75 and if I remember right the drill has 0234-75 on the name plate. You'll know it as the gear case is buffed up bright. There is a special branding label on them too.

                For owners of Milwaukee Magnum drills with metal gear case and 5.5 Amp motors, give yourself a little gift and older the 49-15-0200 deluxe side handle kit. Once installed you'll have a 360 degree rotatation side handle and you can reverse it (end for end) so you can use it in either hand. I have found this to work out very well. Just don't do this on OSHA watched job sites or they may become upset. This is the same side handle used with the right angle head kit.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                  While I would not pay much for this not knowing the condition here's an add for the trusty old 0222-1 so you can look at it. I think I goofed and was sort of thinking this was the Magnum, but this is the father to it in 3/8" drills. Now I have to go look up the right model number of the 3/8" Magnum drill I have in mind. Checking to make sure, the Magnum 3/8" drill that's very much like the 0234-1 of today is the model 0224-1. If you own or have seen a 0234-1 just think of it geared faster and with a very beefy 3/8 chuck on it. A friend has one of them that's the origional type with the 4.5 Amp motor. The 5.5 Amp motor came after a few other changes to the Magnum series.

                  If I remember right the 0222-1 has a 3.5 Amp motor and the spindle is a #2 Jacobs taper on the early ones and was later changed to a threaded spindle which more than likely is 3/8-24 thread.

                  Getting some parts for vintage power tools end up being a real PITA at times, but then when fixed up you have a great tool to be proud to own.


                  Time for me to shut up now. I have almost gone totally wild over this, but it brings back some good memories and my own thinking I should have grabbed up a few of both models when I could have.
                  Last edited by Woussko; 09-17-2007, 11:45 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                    Woussko:

                    My 1/2" Milwaukee is the 0234-1 (5.5 amp). Great drill, in my opinion.

                    Like you, I wish that the Old Milwaukee Electric Tool Corp. would come back again. I hate to see what has happened to the tool industry, both hand and power tools. Not to offend anyone, but when I see "Made In China" I now look elsewhere. That goes for tools, toys, etc.

                    Yes, the 32BA is large.

                    I hope I can see both the Makita 6402 and the Dewalt DW223G. It is becoming more difficult to find corded drills (except for the keyless variety)The Dewalt is about 30% more in cost and is rated at 7 amps verses 5.7 amps for the Makita, yet the DW223G weighs .1 lb less.

                    Do you own a cordless drill? The new Ridgid is selling quite well. At $179, the price is tempting. I purchased the Bosch PS20-2 driver and I am very impressed with Litheon technlogy. Has great shelf life!

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                    • #11
                      Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                      My cordless drills are old timers that I fix up as needed. My main one is a "One of a Kind" DeWalt 14.4 Volt Drill-Driver and the battery packs have been rebuilt a few times with new cells. I got lucky in that the charger had a recall and for some insane reason when I sent my old one in, they mailed me 2 new ones. Just crazy luck I guess.

                      I think when it comes to buying new cordless tools it might be wise to hold off for now. After 2008 rolls in the dealers will want to clean house before invertory time and there should be some nice sales. I'm also thinking we will see newer and hopefully improved Li-Ion batteries and chargers. People all over this forum are upset at how hard it is to buy additional or replacement batteries and chargers for Ridgid cordless tools. I just growl at TTI for that mess.

                      Keep your eyes and ears open as you may be able to find a good older Milwaukee 3/8 drill and fix (or have it fixed) up good again.

                      I hate buying tools and other products from China and more than quality it;s the hell hole working conditions over there with child slave labor. No way can I support such.

                      By the way please download the PDF file on Jacobs chucks when you have a chance. I think you'll be glad to have the info. Maybe you already have it.
                      Last edited by Woussko; 09-18-2007, 12:23 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                        Originally posted by Woussko View Post
                        Quick question

                        Which 1/2 inch Milwaukee do you have?

                        If you can find one in mint condition the 75th anniversary edition of the 0234 is one nice drill to have. It comes with a very nice steel case too. The box it come in will be 0236-75 and if I remember right the drill has 0234-75 on the name plate. You'll know it as the gear case is buffed up bright. There is a special branding label on them too.

                        For owners of Milwaukee Magnum drills with metal gear case and 5.5 Amp motors, give yourself a little gift and older the 49-15-0200 deluxe side handle kit. Once installed you'll have a 360 degree rotatation side handle and you can reverse it (end for end) so you can use it in either hand. I have found this to work out very well. Just don't do this on OSHA watched job sites or they may become upset. This is the same side handle used with the right angle head kit.
                        Why would they have a problem with the side handle?
                        I have a 0234-1 that I bought new. It came with the side handle you describe. I've never had a problem with it.
                        "When we build let us think we build forever. Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone. Let it be such work that our descendants will thank us for, and let us think, as we lay stone upon stone, that a time is to come when these stones will be held sacred because our hands have touched them, and that men will say, as they look upon the labor and wrought substance of them, "See! This our fathers did for us."
                        John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                          The side handle I'm talking about is not the origional one that screws into the side of the gear case. It uses a ring. Personally I think it's far better and safer than the origional but MET and OSHA may not agree.

                          I see the problem now. The 49-15-0200 "Auxilary Side Handle Kit" (looking at label on bag it came in) is made up of the side handle #43-62-0885 and handle ring #25-82-0130.

                          The 49-15-0200 normally is used with the right angle head #48-06-2871 on a D handle drill. I was trying things one time and found it fits and works very well as a side handle on the Magnum drills. It will not work with the origional 4.5 Amp. Magnum drills with an all plastic gear case. It does work well with the later Magunm series with aluminum gear cases. You can also attach it directly behind the chuck to the gear case of many Milwaukee D handle drills but the handle is kind of short for such use. Some of the older 1/2" D handle drills with 4.0 Amp motors used this type side handle but it was all steel.

                          Please see attached .PDF file for more info and details.
                          Attached Files
                          Last edited by Woussko; 09-18-2007, 06:26 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                            Woussko:

                            I would also like to pick up a corded hammerdrill (minimum chuck size 1/2"). Do you have any suggestions/recommendations?

                            Also have you ever used the Milwaukee Cobalt bits (48-89-0050)? I also see that Irwin has two grades of Cobalt (35 and 42). Milwaukee does not state their hardness.

                            BTW, I tried to find a 0222-1 (used) but all I saw on ebay were two very beat up units. Yesterday I also went looking for either a Dewalt DW223G or a Makita 6402 - no luck. All I could find were the low end products with keyless chucks. I did see a Dewalt 235G, it was pretty nose heavy. It does weigh 4.2 lbs. verses 3.6 lbs. for the DW223G, so maybe the the DW223G has a better balance.

                            Thanks

                            Alan

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Milwaukee 3/8" corded

                              I wish I could tell you more on hammer drills but I just don't have enough experience with them. Chic would be a good person to ask as he works in a power tool repair shop.

                              As for cobalt twist drills, I would recommend you buy a brand and type under the manufacture. Milwaukee has their's made under contract. It seems that most are the M42 alloy that I see. This is where I would go to an industrial supply house.
                              PrecisionTwist Drill, Cleveland, Chicago-Latrobe or the real Morse brand would be my choices for a quality product. Because you'll have to pay some good money for a good set, you may as well buy industrial quality that's known to be good. I would check in your yellow pages under "Industrial Supplies" and see what you come up with. Also a good national source would be McMaster-Carr and you can get to their web site at www.mcmaster.com ... I sometimes use MSC Industrial Supply www.mscdirect.com as they have good and vast stock and ship fast, but their prices are on the high side. If you want good, but not the best, you can look into Triumph brand too. I have used some of their twist drills and find them not bad if you buy the proper ones for a given use. Can I ask why you want to go with Cobalt twist drills? In a good many cases when drilling steel (unless it's a wild alloy) you can do pretty well with M1 high speed but heavy duty type with 135 split point and save some $$$. Be sure to use a tool coolant.

                              When it comes to locating a Makita 6402 hang in there for a bit. I want to check it out for myself. I just found it on their site and it looked about like what I thought you might like. For myself I would get a Milwaukee 0234 (try to find new old stock or mint used) and convert it to a 3/8 drill, but you really don't want to go through all that. Making your own tool is big $$$ and frustrating at best. You might pickup a new 0233-20 and change the chuck over to a keyed type. I have used this model and find it to be a good drill, but it's setup more like a powerful 1/4" model in that it's geared fast. If you just want it to drill holes it should work well. It's a great drill for wood drilling and small holes in metal. Sometimes you can find one that's been totally reconditioned (more like a dealer got one back and sent it to the MET factory shop) where the tool will be in great shape and at some $$$ off new.

                              Try calling up a place called Power Tool Services at 1-877-585-9328 (Toll Free) and tell them what you're looking for. They are Milwaukee only. They just may have some reconditioned older models they would sell at a nice price.
                              Last edited by Woussko; 09-19-2007, 10:46 AM.

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