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  • Lithium Lithium Lithium

    So we al know that lithium has been out for awhile. Anyone think one brand has a better chemical over the other. Manuf. say one thing, customer tests say another!

    Lithium Oxide?

    Lithium Manganese?

    Nano Phosphate Lithium Ion?

  • #2
    Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

    It sounds like bait post just to get a little traffic to your forum (yeah, I can can see right thru you).

    There is a ton of tests and spec sheets, especially on RCGroups.com. Dewalt's LiFePO4 is the safest, has the highest cycle life and highest discharge current. eMoli used in milwaukee v28 have the highest energy density but wear out very fast. Manganese oxide cells in makita/bosch/ridgid et al are better in terms of cycles but absolutely suck compared to dewalt. If you click on my sig there is a ton of information on this.

    Also, your little forum is bound to fail because you didn't do your SEO homework. Google is going to drown it in SERPs within 10 days because you have session IDs in forum URLs and they are not searchengine-friendly.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

      I don't think many people care about battery chemistry, as long as it works well.

      When comparing most cordless tools, they are all about the same in a given voltage range. I'm not going to go running out to buy the latest cordless line just because a company claims 10 in-lbs more torque or 20 more battery charge cycles more than last years tools.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

        Originally posted by DRC-Wartex View Post
        It sounds like bait post just to get a little traffic to your forum (yeah, I can can see right thru you).

        There is a ton of tests and spec sheets, especially on RCGroups.com. Dewalt's LiFePO4 is the safest, has the highest cycle life and highest discharge current. eMoli used in milwaukee v28 have the highest energy density but wear out very fast. Manganese oxide cells in makita/bosch/ridgid et al are better in terms of cycles but absolutely suck compared to dewalt. If you click on my sig there is a ton of information on this.

        Also, your little forum is bound to fail because you didn't do your SEO homework. Google is going to drown it in SERPs within 10 days because you have session IDs in forum URLs and they are not searchengine-friendly.
        Isn't this pretty much what you did when you joined the forum a month or so ago? This is a powertool forum, not a forum to bash or advertise other forums.

        Anywho, welcome to the forum, Dewalt might use better chemistry i guess but I have lost faith in them completely. Obvisouly I'm not the only one! I think what most of us care about is that if it works, great, if I can tell its better than what was out before even better, but to discuss which mix of chemicals is better, uhhh, give me back my battery pack so I can get back to work

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

          Originally posted by Ru&Lins_05 View Post
          Isn't this pretty much what you did when you joined the forum a month or so ago? This is a powertool forum, not a forum to bash or advertise other forums.
          Here here, on both points, and towards both posters.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

            Originally posted by DRC-Wartex View Post
            It sounds like bait post just to get a little traffic to your forum (yeah, I can can see right thru you).

            There is a ton of tests and spec sheets, especially on RCGroups.com. Dewalt's LiFePO4 is the safest, has the highest cycle life and highest discharge current. eMoli used in milwaukee v28 have the highest energy density but wear out very fast. Manganese oxide cells in makita/bosch/ridgid et al are better in terms of cycles but absolutely suck compared to dewalt. If you click on my sig there is a ton of information on this.

            Also, your little forum is bound to fail because you didn't do your SEO homework. Google is going to drown it in SERPs within 10 days because you have session IDs in forum URLs and they are not searchengine-friendly.
            Funny that you have a similar link in your signature!

            Anywho, I am curious about different technologies because it is the platform for any cordless tool you own. If I am only going to get 400 charge cycles from manuf X and 1500 charge cycles from manuf Z, then I might be swayed to purchase a different platform.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

              Yeah, it's funny how nobody noticed my site actually has useful content, it's not a power-tool related forum, it's not called ThePowerToolForum.com, but rather it is a small collection of my findings about power tools on a large board with mutiple forums that has been up for nearly a decade, with no comments in my Toolbox section because I created it purely to share information and because creating a blog would be redundant. I don't care if you post anything on my site, the link only points to relevant information that's already there, ready for you to read. I don't expect you to post there because even if you do it will be immediately deleted unless it's a correction or extra information about a particular cordless tool.

              If you still fail to see the difference:
              I create content for you. He wants you to create content for him. It's that simple.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                Originally posted by Sceeter W Wheels View Post
                I don't think many people care about battery chemistry, as long as it works well.

                When comparing most cordless tools, they are all about the same in a given voltage range. I'm not going to go running out to buy the latest cordless line just because a company claims 10 in-lbs more torque or 20 more battery charge cycles more than last years tools.
                I disagree. Dewalt's cells can withstand over 1000 cycles with minimal capacity loss (15%) while Makita LXT will lose 60% capacity after 500 cycles. Dewalt's cells have 70 A max discharge current while Makita's will detonate at 20 A. Dewalts cells do not explode if overcharged and are much safer. Makita cells deteriorate in temperatures over 42 C while this is normal temperature for Dewalt. Dewalt's battery internal resistance reduces over time, while Makita's increases. This is a HUGE difference. Makita batteries are $65 and Dewalt is $95 if bought online, so $30 for much better performance is a steal.

                Makita's 18v LXT grinder can make 17 cuts of 1/2" rebar while dewalt's 18 can do only 10. Dewalr designed that poorly. Dewalts DC390 18v circular saw makes 75 cuts of 2x4 on one 2.4 Ah battery while makita barely makes 60 on a 3 Ah battery. That is a huge difference as well.

                Point is: tools are not anywhere same for a given voltage and performance varies greatly between different tools from different manufacturers.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                  Originally posted by DRC-Wartex View Post
                  I disagree. Dewalt's cells can withstand over 1000 cycles with minimal capacity loss (15%) while Makita LXT will lose 60% capacity after 500 cycles. Dewalt's cells have 70 A max discharge current while Makita's will detonate at 20 A. Dewalts cells do not explode if overcharged and are much safer. Makita cells deteriorate in temperatures over 42 C while this is normal temperature for Dewalt. Dewalt's battery internal resistance reduces over time, while Makita's increases. This is a HUGE difference. Makita batteries are $65 and Dewalt is $95 if bought online, so $30 for much better performance is a steal.

                  Makita's 18v LXT grinder can make 17 cuts of 1/2" rebar while dewalt's 18 can do only 10. Dewalr designed that poorly. Dewalts DC390 18v circular saw makes 75 cuts of 2x4 on one 2.4 Ah battery while makita barely makes 60 on a 3 Ah battery. That is a huge difference as well.

                  Point is: tools are not anywhere same for a given voltage and performance varies greatly between different tools from different manufacturers.
                  All I know is after using Dewalt ( went through 4 units in 4 months) I switch to Milwalkee then to El Chepo then to Ridgid. I use 18 volters and about 6 months ago switched to the lithium. Just love the power.The other day I went to use it and had to charge the batteries. It finally got cold here..killed the battery. Well, one battery charged right up. The second....well lets say that the charger indicated 'DAMAGED'. Not a happy camper at this point. So I took it to a Rigdig Repair shop and had to give up my drill, charger and battery. It will be two weeks before I get it back. Now I need to go out to get another El Cheapo till this comes back. If the battery goes out in 6 months is it a Ridgid problem or do I need to 'Heat' my van on cold winter nights?? These things should last for at least a year I'd hope. Anyone have a 'damaged' problem this soon??
                  Last edited by rctech1; 11-01-2008, 09:26 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                    Several ?? Can the lithium batteries be charged with the older 18 volt chargers? Can the lithium batteries be used on the older 18 volt tools? Can the new tools with the lithium batteries run using the older 18 volt batteries? Thanks

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                      Originally posted by streamer View Post
                      Can the lithium batteries be charged with the older 18 volt chargers? Can the lithium batteries be used on the older 18 volt tools? Can the new tools with the lithium batteries run using the older 18 volt batteries?
                      My response applies to current Ridgid 18V power tools:
                      IMO NOT recommended to charge Lithium battery on NiCad charger
                      18V Li battery/tool can be used in 18V NiCad battery/tool (interchangeable)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                        Originally posted by streamer View Post
                        Several ?? Can the lithium batteries be charged with the older 18 volt chargers? Can the lithium batteries be used on the older 18 volt tools? Can the new tools with the lithium batteries run using the older 18 volt batteries? Thanks
                        As far as I know, old chargers do not have the technology required to charge a lithium battery. However any new charger that comes with a ithium tool should charge both systems. Someone please correct me if I am wrong. I know that Ryobi and Dewalt systems are frontward and backward compatiable with each other. I'm not sure if anyone else's is.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                          Originally posted by rctech1 View Post
                          All I know is after using Dewalt ( went through 4 units in 4 months) I switch to Milwalkee then to El Chepo then to Ridgid. I use 18 volters and about 6 months ago switched to the lithium. Just love the power.The other day I went to use it and had to charge the batteries. It finally got cold here..killed the battery. Well, one battery charged right up. The second....well lets say that the charger indicated 'DAMAGED'. Not a happy camper at this point. So I took it to a Rigdig Repair shop and had to give up my drill, charger and battery. It will be two weeks before I get it back. Now I need to go out to get another El Cheapo till this comes back. If the battery goes out in 6 months is it a Ridgid problem or do I need to 'Heat' my van on cold winter nights?? These things should last for at least a year I'd hope. Anyone have a 'damaged' problem this soon??
                          We have been using the Ridgid 24V and 18V LI batts for two years and our experiance has shown that Ridgid LI batts will not hold up overnight in temps lower than 35 or so degrees. We have had no problems with damage. They simply immediately die with use after a cold night in a truck, especially the
                          24s under heavy load like a recip or circ saw. We keep the batteries in a heated room and load them up in the morning when it's cold.
                          When a Ridgid LI batt has been left out in 35 degree weather sometimes it's necessary to stick the battery in the charger a couple of times to take a charge......reset it maybe! If the service center is nearby I would stop by and see if the battery will reset if you place it in the charger a couple of times.
                          Good luck....Ray
                          Last edited by roadrashray; 11-02-2008, 09:13 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                            This is for Streamer....
                            Do a search and you'll find a myriad of posts regarding lithium batteries etc.

                            simply put:

                            1. All Rigid 18v power tools can run on any 18v nicad battery or any 18v lithium-ion
                            battery. This includes their dual voltage 18/24v designed battery powered tools. For
                            the non technical folks the amp-hour rating is not critical but the working voltage is the
                            key! For example there are 18v batteries from 1.9AH to 3AH. The current rating is what
                            allows you to run longer, harder before needing to charge the battery.

                            2. ONLY Ridgid battery chargers with the "lithium-ion" decal is appropriate for their
                            18v lithium-ion battery. You will read different opinions about this, but for now
                            the only 18v lithium-ion charger from Ridgid is their single design battery charger.
                            This charger will do all of their batteries except their 24v ones which has a unique
                            charger. The dual charger will not safely charge lithium-ion batteries. I repeat, you will
                            read various opinions about this and even Ridgid seems to be vague on this specific
                            topic. To be safe..use the correct charger!


                            Cactus Man

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Lithium Lithium Lithium

                              Thanks to all who replied to my ? about charging Lithium batteries. I guess my son will get my old combo set and I will spring for the new combo set with the Lithium batts. Thanks

                              Comment

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