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  • #16
    Originally posted by hewood:
    So now I suppose that cheap handmade heavy gauge steel Biesemeyer with the ultra smooth laminated faces is less expensive to manufacture than the sophisticated aluminum and plastic Ridgid fence?

    I imagine if I went to a Corvette Club meeting and asked if a Viper was any good, that I'd be told that 10 cylinders is too heavy and sucks too much gas. That the Viper has no finesse and is all just horsepower that can't be applied to the road, and that there's nothing to justify the cost of the Viper except the marketing hype to keep the cost up. And I'm sure someone would offer their "opinion" that a fiberglass body adds as much or more strength than steel ... blah, blah, blah...."I want it to be so, therefore it must be so."

    Excuse me now fellas, I've got to go call Delta, Powermatic, Jet, General, General International, Bridgewood, Shop Fox, Grizzly, Woodtek, Laguna, Excaliber, Vega, and God only knows who else, to let them know they've got the wrong fence concept, and that they've been spending way too much money on fences. The whole industry is going to be so disappointed. [img]tongue.gif[/img]
    You missed the point! The price is set by what the market will bear. If you get enough people to talk it up you will sell more. That is called advertising.
    What I'm saying is manufacturing costs does not justify the price.
    Pay what ever you want. But I have to giggle a little when I see everyone forking up big bucks for it. By the way I also giggle at Viper and Corvette owners. Neither one carries enough wood for me.
    Rev Ed

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    • #17
      Anybody remember what the original question was?
      Teach your kids about taxes..........eat 30 percent of their ice cream.

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      • #18
        ...there was a question?

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        • #19
          It does look as if this has turned into a fence discussion but I want to throw something else in the mix. I keep hearing about the Ridgid cast zinc trunnions. Has anyone ever had a problem from these. I do agree that cast iron sounds better but is it? Why?

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          • #20
            Messmaker - Cast iron is stronger than zinc...alot stronger if I recall correctly from metallurgy class. This doesn't necessarily mean that the zinc will pose a problem in this application, but it's a deviation from standard materials for trunnions on saws in this price range that doesn't offer any improvements that I'm aware of.

            Even cast iron does occasionally crack (usually due to a mfging defect), and the teeth of the gears can wear over time, so I suspect the die cast zinc is subjected to the same issues. I'd prefer they went with cast iron. Maybe someone else can chime in with any advantages of die cast zinc, I'm just not aware of any.

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            • #21
              Zinc is cheaper to mass produce.
              I used to work in a diecast shop and we turned out zinc parts by the bushel. They are cast much the same way as injection molded plastic.
              The way I see it, if you keep the areas of wear greased the pivots should last the life of the saw. JMO

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              • #22
                Originally posted by messmaker:
                It does look as if this has turned into a fence discussion but I want to throw something else in the mix. I keep hearing about the Ridgid cast zinc trunnions. Has anyone ever had a problem from these. I do agree that cast iron sounds better but is it? Why?
                Back in the days when Ridgid responded to this forum, this question was asked. The moderator of the forum responded that he had never heard of a failure or a problem with the trunions. If you look at the construction of the whole under body of the ridgid you will see in many cases it is superior to all other Contractor Saws. I'm not sure why Ridgid choose to use the trunions they did but I have to guess their engineering believed they would hold up, and history so far bears that out.
                Rev Ed

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                • #23
                  Hi Rev Ed - I've looked under the 3650 a several times. I see a big DC shroud that I think is good, but I'm not seeing anything in the actual trunnions that appeared superior to me....in fact I remember thinking that they appeared a tad smaller, but I didn't take any measurements. Next time I get a chance, I'll take another gander to see if I can discover what caught your attention. Regardless, it doesn't sound like the trunnions have been a problem thus far.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by hewood:
                    Hi Rev Ed - I've looked under the 3650 a several times. I see a big DC shroud that I think is good, but I'm not seeing anything in the actual trunnions that appeared superior to me....in fact I remember thinking that they appeared a tad smaller, but I didn't take any measurements. Next time I get a chance, I'll take another gander to see if I can discover what caught your attention. Regardless, it doesn't sound like the trunnions have been a problem thus far.
                    First I didn't say trunions were superior I said the whole underside was.
                    Let me give you some things to look for. Look at any contractor saw and you will notice two steel tube connecting everything. They have a casting the goes into the trunions, then a casting to hold the actual arbor and another casting to go into the other trunion all connected and joined by these two tubes. Many people complain about Contractor Saws heeling when cranked over into a bevel. I think the fact that there are three casting hooked to tow steel tubes may be a factor.

                    Now look at the Ridgid, it is one iron casting that runs front to back that set in the trunions. The arbor is another casting that mated to this casting so you can raise and lower the blade. There are two stell bars but they only hold the saw guard and I possibly the motor.

                    The only other non cabinet saw built like this is a Dewalt 746.
                    Rev Ed

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                    • #25
                      As much as I would like to jump into this discussion. I think I'll just ride the fence on this topic.
                      Jeff

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                      • #26
                        Andrew - No doubt there are pros and cons to every fence design out there. Deflection on a t-type is a known fact, but the deflection is neglible on most of the good examples of this design when optimized....as in 1/64" with 20# lateral force, which is alot more than you're likely to apply when ripping wood. The upside is it's indisputable repeatability and ruggedness, which are just a couple of the reasons it's such a widely copied design, even on saws where cost is much less of a concern.

                        A dual locking design has two points that need to be in proper alignment in order get the desired parallism, the t-type only one. The fence on the 3650 can be locked down out of parallel if the proper technique is not used....seen it, done it.

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                        • #27
                          My first saw was and old sears 70's type and I always got into the habit of applying pressure to the fence against the rail and then locking it so I do not seem to have a problem with that. I just can not see why you would want a non t-slot fence with glued on laminate faces that are prone to wear and harder to mount aux. things to it and replace. I would rather have the Delta Uni Fence on a Uni Saw. I just think it is the name/status that causes more desire to many people. The durability could also be a main issue in abusive shop enviorments.

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                          • #28
                            Great thread! I'm all Ridgid now thanks to the great grey tool closeout, but no TS yet. I may be leaning towards the 3650 now.

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