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TS3650 - Is it generally a solid saw

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  • #46
    hewood,

    I'm not gonna argue that. No such thing as patents in some of the asian countries.. LOL

    But I don't like spreading rumors. However the dealer where I bought my PM told me that some of the discount tool companies like grizzly < not sure if general is in that group or not > sell tools that companies like Powermatic & Delta & jet reject for quality reasons.

    Maybe the tool mfr's sell overproduction to them, maybe they sell quasi defective ones. I really don't know. However I'm trying to figure this out over time and am always keeping my ear to the pavement for credible information in this arena. That was just something that peaked my interest when he says they don't always have them. And backorder. I had backorder on my 50" rails, but every dealer I go to has most saws in stock unless there's a big sale and are quickly replenished when they're out.

    Just some food for thought? Anybody have any input gladly listen

    Also. I don't think the PM 66 could have a better finish.. LOL. Really. It's like a frigging mirror. my guess is they have same finish on cast iron. Only downside is I always catch myself polishing it b/c I want to keep it that way. So maybe it's not such a good thing

    Jake

    Comment


    • #47
      Jake - I'd be scared to death to put that first scratch on a PM66!

      You know enough about business to realize that Grizzly and GI wouldn't stay in business long selling PM rejects. Did you mean parts like the 50" PM rails? LOL! When's the last time you heard a General owner complain of something breaking or being out of tolerance? It happens to all companies sooner or later, but if it were an everyday occurrence they'd have to run the business like HF. Not sure that Griz and GI are all that similar anyway. I own both and think the GI is a step up. Better finish anyway. Usually GI gets a premium over Griz...could be the dealer's cut...

      Sorry if we're stealing the thread, but at least we seem to be enjoying the discussion!

      Comment


      • #48
        No no no.. Your not steeling it at all. I am very much enjoying reading it.

        The GI dealer also told me also on the phone that unless I ordered on the phone that I was taking a risk of them all being sold by the time they arrived. Said that two of them on order were already sold. Leaving 3 that were not. Said there may be some left when they arrive, and maybe not. Guess I could just take my chances. Oh and no chance for any kind of discount either.

        Damn... This is hard. I really want to keep that extra 150.00 and apply it to something like a scroll saw or something, at the same time, I want a SOLID PROVEN table saw.

        I have to admit, I am starting to lean towards the GI now. Was perfectly happy with the Ridgid until you guys had to cast doubts in my head. Now I about to drive myself nuts with this decision

        Comment


        • #49
          yeah sorry bout the thread steal.. LOL

          Hewood you are right. I also know that these tools even in taiwann or china are not free. Shipping alone is prohibitive. There has to be something in there that allows their production cost to be sizeably different. Like I said. I don't have an answer today. If you chage less you have to take that money out of some pocket

          Customer service
          Design
          Distribution
          Production
          Profit

          Not many companies are willing to work for free so that leaves the 4 other areas to work from.

          I personally have walked through harbor freight and most every tool ( the free standing ones ) I see their is kinda junky to me. However I'm happy to buy a set of wrenches there. However I read lots of people harp on how great they are. I like to use my own experience over other's opinions unless I know the individual and their credibility personally. My problem is I haven't seen or used either of these. So I'm just boffled.. LOL

          Jake

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          • #50
            m00n the price difference they quoted between the 30 and 50" fences are right about on the money on the difference between the two, sold separately, plus the extra insert table. To give you an idea, the 30" sells for about $269 and the 50" sells for $322----
            Dave

            Comment


            • #51
              Moon,
              Does the GI dealer have one on display? If so, go and check it out. Shake it, twist it, play with the miter gage and fence and handwheels. I assume you have already done the same with the Ridgid. Which one "feels better" to you? That's the one you want! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
              Lorax
              "Did you put the yellow key in the switch?" TOD 01/09/06

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by daveferg:
                m00n the price difference they quoted between the 30 and 50" fences are right about on the money on the difference between the two, sold separately, plus the extra insert table. To give you an idea, the 30" sells for about $269 and the 50" sells for $322----
                Not quite - the difference above is $53 and big jump from what they quoted. Only a retailer can take and make this type of mark-up and get away with it. Unless my math is wrong they increased price by nearly $110. 749-639=110
                Does anyone believe the cost to distributer from General for the upgrade is more than $40? at high end? I don't - that's what the spread was just a month or so back when some in MN and NY were wandering over border to pick up there.
                Everyone needs to make money and when the item is ordered on your behalf they make even more. No floor planning - no inventory - just profit.
                The Rigid 3650 sale price is truly starting to look like the most incredible buy of 2003 for those that received it. Some had 30% discount - a decent saw for $420 - the same price of some of these universal motored Delta and Craftsman and like.
                I cannot see how they can ever duplicate that sale - just not enough margin there. Congratulations to all who did

                [ 01-23-2004, 09:05 AM: Message edited by: ChipMaker ]

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Cranky:
                  Looking at this general, I notice that I can get either a left or right cut unit. Are there reasons why I would want to buy one over the other?
                  Tilt is a personal preference in my opinion---a million threads and things been said pro-con.

                  Start here and decide what works best for you and if a sliding table will ever be used.

                  http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthr...fpart=all&vc=1


                  http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthr...rue#Post705449

                  Do a search and you'll read more than you ever want to on this if you so desire. Weeks even worth of reading - and debate rages on.

                  A year ago some General dealers were said to have offered a small discount if they really hungry to move tools. Highly doubt it now as the currency exchange rates have done the dollar no good - rather than raise some prices they have toed the line on old prices tho which is nice.
                  Margins always in the extra goodies they sell - these mobiles bases with $3-5 worth of steel in them sell at anywhere from $49 to $100 plus. Imagine that - buy 10 of these spendy bases and you'd have a Grizz 1023 CS. Yep - they make it on accessories. Way to much. [/QB][/QUOTE]

                  Read your post ___ Now I got ya hooked o'er on woodnet too m00n - see how this thing goes!
                  Gonna say this also - and mean it in all sincerity. You gettin' mighty mighty close at $749 to the Griz 1023 range, especially if you have to pay sales tax there. If one reaches to higher shelf to get something the next level is just a tad higher. Full blown CS vs a TS. Another $126 gets ya there, less if ya pay sales tax. To me now anyway I'd really have to chew on this.

                  I'd definetly myself jump to the Griz but I can justify it based on these numbers. And while I don't need a big ol' CS I know I'd use it alot and can therein justify other side too. Not sure if this will apply to you as much even at future date based on what you've stated. You may or may not.Goes back to the "how much is enough and how much is to much" thing. This is where we all part ways......................

                  I was lucky sales priced buyer of 3650-almost 2 for the price of 1 Griz. Darn near 2 for price of one GI at that.

                  Oh boy - I will further muddy the waters now
                  Sorry

                  [ 01-23-2004, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Cranky ]
                  Wish I had the answers ..... even half of \'em

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by ChipMaker:
                    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by daveferg:
                    m00n the price difference they quoted between the 30 and 50" fences are right about on the money on the difference between the two, sold separately, plus the extra insert table. To give you an idea, the 30" sells for about $269 and the 50" sells for $322----
                    Not quite - the difference above is $53 and big jump from what they quoted. Only a retailer can take and make this type of mark-up and get away with it. Unless my math is wrong they increased price by nearly $110. 749-639=110
                    Does anyone believe the cost to distributer from General for the upgrade is more than $40? at high end? I don't - that's what the spread was just a month or so back when some in MN and NY were wandering over border to pick up there.
                    Everyone needs to make money and when the item is ordered on your behalf they make even more. No floor planning - no inventory - just profit.
                    The Rigid 3650 sale price is truly starting to look like the most incredible buy of 2003 for those that received it. Some had 30% discount - a decent saw for $420 - the same price of some of these universal motored Delta and Craftsman and like.
                    I cannot see how they can ever duplicate that sale - just not enough margin there. Congratulations to all who did
                    </font>[/QUOTE]This got me curious so I made a call.
                    GI 50-185 w/ 52" rails and router insert is now $611.85 USD ---- if ya willing to drive to get over border that is (this was outta ThunderBay area)
                    Man - the dollar is getting weaker by the day. I looked and got pricing last spring on this-plus $60 in 9 months. Good for those living just north of me no doubt. And I do love all ya cannuckers I do. Best fishin' waters in the world too.
                    Wish I had the answers ..... even half of \'em

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      cranky you're a smart cookie

                      I heard on the news the other day that european vacations are steepening for the rason you mentioned bout dollar weakening. In the neighborhood of 20 % more expensive today then just a year or 2 ago. Maybe this will help us with exportation of jobs &lt; I SURE HOPE SO &gt;

                      REgarding them being kind to us about not raising prices. This is because we are still the largest consumer market in the world. Don't wanna buck the bull.

                      Jake

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by woodworkerjake:
                        cranky you're a smart cookie

                        I heard on the news the other day that european vacations are steepening for the rason you mentioned bout dollar weakening. In the neighborhood of 20 % more expensive today then just a year or 2 ago. Maybe this will help us with exportation of jobs &lt; I SURE HOPE SO &gt;

                        REgarding them being kind to us about not raising prices. This is because we are still the largest consumer market in the world. Don't wanna buck the bull.

                        Jake
                        Good point - we buy bundles down here don't we

                        They probably could get away with it tho as so dang manner others sure as heck passing it thru and on us.Guess it be what goes around comes around or whatever.

                        Helluva a time to head to Europe now - some friends did it at Christmas and they gonna be paying for it for a long time.....all on CC's at that. Kinda foolish way to go IMO....but hey-we only here a short time I guess so whatever trips ones trigger.
                        They coulda sent us eh! We coulda brought e'm back some pictures and a trinket too.
                        Wish I had the answers ..... even half of \'em

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Chipmaker----sorry but, I ommitted the price difference between the extension table inserts between the two sizes of fence.

                          I'm a bit confused. Is the $611 a higher Canadian price? A weak dollar actually raises the cost of imports.

                          In any event, that is one heck of a deal. Wonder if you have to pay duty, coming back over the border?

                          Good luck m00n.
                          Dave

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by daveferg:
                            Chipmaker----sorry but, I ommitted the price difference between the extension table inserts between the two sizes of fence.

                            I'm a bit confused. Is the $611 a higher Canadian price? A weak dollar actually raises the cost of imports.

                            In any event, that is one heck of a deal. Wonder if you have to pay duty, coming back over the border?

                            Good luck m00n.
                            Yes - it is higher now. No duty - taxes if paid refunded with paperwork at border also. Not sure what the dollar limit is but you can get both the TS and jointer and not exceed it.

                            Proximity here to Canada is likely why they light on distributers around here. WI and MN folks always seem to spend time fishing and such and easy to just add a extra trip a little further at that. Scott at the Thunder Bay place said about 2 of every 3 sold thru them goes south across border thru MN. Not surprised - seen many pick-ups with "big boxes" in bed pulling a boat going thru Customs. Used to be real fast - now suppose slower with all issues. Would be with or without goodies tho.
                            If one can do it that way it's a savings. Warranty is still covered as usual.

                            [ 01-23-2004, 11:24 AM: Message edited by: Cranky ]
                            Wish I had the answers ..... even half of \'em

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Hey all... Still very tempted by the ridgid... Allows me a little wiggle room for a few nice blades.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by m00n:
                                Hey all... Still very tempted by the ridgid... Allows me a little wiggle room for a few nice blades.
                                So the woodnet gang didn't chase you away from it then?! It gets mighty "interesting" there. Sometimes to much for me even

                                No jake-not you


                                If this saw ends up being the one - if you can hold off for bit I'd maybe do so and see if the sale does appear - wouldn't be surprised to see it kick in about the day the switch warranty (if they don't extend again)
                                Wish I had the answers ..... even half of \'em

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