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  • Help! My saw won't cut.

    My Christmas new MS1290LZA saw will not cut for crap.
    I think I know why.
    It might have something to do with a very small kitchen's worth of laminate flooring that I helped a friend install two weekends ago.
    The saw ripped right through that stuff without hesitation, but when I went to cut some 1x5" oak this weekend, I had to make six or seven passes. The cuts left my work pieces with very shiny, black burn marks.

    Now to my two part question:
    1. Is there a way for a mere mortal to sharpen a carbide tipped saw blade? Or do I have to take it somewhere to have it done?
    • If it's a "do it yourself thing" can you point me to some instructions?
    1. (That should have been 2! this Rich Text is SO helpful) How much should I expect to pay if I have to have a professional sharpen it for me? I would hate to have to pay $35 to sharpen a saw blade I can replace (upgrade?) for $45, not to mention being without it for a week.
    Before you all yell at me, I searched using the terms "sharpen saw" and "sharpen saw blade" and found nothing relevant. (gunshy from other forums)

  • #2
    Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

    A) Sharpening a carbide tipped saw blade is not a DIY project.

    B) Unless it's a high end blade or you can get a special deal with the company that made it, most likely you'll be better off to replace it and maybe keep the old one for nasty work.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

      I will jsut ask, is the blade on the correct and the teeth the correct direction?

      I am not saying the laminate would not dull the carbide blade, and NO I do not know how many cuts made, but for the most part my experience has been carbide will go long long time and cut a lot of things before needing sharping, for the most part, but I could see the blade cutting the laminate in backwards and not the oak, but I would think you would have noticed some major degrade in the cuts on the laminate towards the end if it is as bad as it appears on the oak,

      manual link
      http://www.ridgid.com/ASSETS/1BC0D6C...ZA_017_eng.pdf

      To sharpen carbide correctly the machine is a high precision machine, unlike on the old steel blades it was basically jsut make sure there was some set and file it or grind it on a simple jig,

      but carbide each tooth is ground with relief angles and the set is in the carbide it self, and many times the teeth are shaped some times up to three or more separate shapes on the blade depending on if it is a right or a left or a center tooth, mostly there are jsut right and left teeth, but usually the machines they sharpen on are very precision, and then the carbide take special grinding wheels to cut the material as a normal aluminum oxide grinding wheel will nearly disappear trying to grind on it, and not do much for the wearing away of the carbide,(OF Course the quality of the wheel has a lot to do with it as well) but special wheels are used normal.
      Last edited by BHD; 02-18-2008, 11:14 AM.
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      • #4
        Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

        Originally posted by BHD View Post
        I will jsut ask, is the blade on the correct and the teeth the correct direction?

        I am not saying the laminate would not dull the carbide blade, and NO I do not know how many cuts made, but for the most part my experience has been carbide will go long long time and cut a lot of things before needing sharping, for the most part, but I could see the blade cutting the laminate in backwards and not the oak, but I would think you would have noticed some major degrade in the cuts on the laminate towards the end if it is as bad as it appears on the oak,

        manual link
        http://www.ridgid.com/ASSETS/1BC0D6C...ZA_017_eng.pdf

        Nothing else has changed. The blade is oriented correctly (like all of the pictures in the manual) and I've used it quite a bit since Christmas. It used to cut like crazy!
        The kitchen was only about 100 Square feet. I used it for that laminate on a Sunday, then left the saw there and picked it up the following Sunday. (gotta love that MS-UV by the way!)

        This was the Ridgid 44 tooth blade that came with the Saw. When I was pricing blades at HD yesterday, I noticed that the 66t blade is what's recommended for Laminate. This may prove to be an expensive lesson.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

          It may well be worth the expense to have the OEM blade resharpened. On the other hand, maybe not. Most OEM blades, but not all, that come with saws are not the greatest to begin with. The last time I had a blade sharpened the cost was 28ยข a tooth. Check with your local ACE or Tru Value hardware store, they should be able to direct you to a local sharpening service.
          ================================================== ====
          ~~Don't worry about old age; it doesn't last that long.

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          • #6
            Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

            Thanks Badger Dave:
            I called the place that we use here at work, and they told me $12.55. I would say that's worth the money. It's also quite convenient.
            Just doing an eyeball comparison, I would say this is (was) a pretty decent saw blade. It compares favorably with all of the gee whiz ones on display.



            To drag up other controversies, the saw on display at the HD where mine was purchased is the old one. (I think LZ, not LZ1 or LZA) What they have in boxes, though seems to be the latest version. The saw blade on mine looks a lot nicer (More like the Freud Diablo) than the one on display. The blade on that one looked very cheap and crappy (like I would really know the difference)
            I'll be dropping the blade off tomorrow.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

              I would not recommend you try to sharpen the blade either, but I do have a suggestion that might help. Sometimes when cutting certain materials you can get a build up around the carbide tooth and even though the cutter is still sharp the build up gives the behavior of a dull blade. If it appears that there is a build up of such material, remove the blade from the saw and either spray it with a good pitch cutter or solvent, or let it sit in a bath of solvent. Then using a wire wheel on a drill, brush from the inside of the blade towards the tooth and outside removing any build up. This is something I do when sharpening my chainsaw chains.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                Frankiarmz:
                I did see some gunk built up on the teeth. I cleaned it off with paint thinner and a wire brush. (rifle cleaning toothbrush would not work) Hopeful, I reinstalled the blade and tried to cut again. No luck. Made more smoke than sawdust. I took it to filegar tool and saw today. They'll take care of me.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                  Kneescar,

                  I had the same problem with my Bosch miter saw. I installed around 200 square feet of laminate floor and toasted my factory blade. When you cut laminate with a miter saw, the carbide tips on the blade are moving almost parallel to the surface when they make first contact. I think this angle causes a lot of heat and wear on the blade. If I ever install laminate again, I'll cut it with a circular or jig saw.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                    Originally posted by Kneescar View Post
                    The cuts left my work pieces with very shiny, black burn marks.
                    First, I agree that you must send the blade out for sharpening, not a DIY project.

                    Second, in moving the saw from place to place there is a very real possibility it was knocked out of adjustment ("shiny black burn marks"). You might try realigning the saw and see what the results are.

                    George

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                    • #11
                      Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                      Laminate flooring has Al Oxide coating and will dull most blades. A TCG is best or I just buy the 10" 50 carbide th combo blades at HFT for less than $10 and throw them out when dull. You can also use a 7 1/4" blade on the flooring. No cut is a precision cut on laminate floors anyway, all is covered by the shoe base. You need 1/4" off the wall for the floor to float.
                      The blade is dull most likely.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                        Armstrong, Pergo and other laminates all have approximately 2mm layer of aluminum oxide as the above poster stated. This material is very hard and wear resistant. Carbide tipped table and miter saw blades are great, but are expensive to resharpen. Bosch jig saw blades also work great; Since you are doing the work yourself, time should not be too much of an issue.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Help! My saw won't cut. Revisited

                          Like I had said before, I took my blade to Filegar cutting technologies. We use these guys where I work, so I was familiar with them. I explained that it cut through the laminate like nobody's business, but after I tried it on oak (and even pine) it wouldn't cut. They said that the blade was just dull, not damaged. They told me it would only require a simple sharpening, not a full re-grind. This place is awesome! They sell their own branded saw blades and will custom grind design saw blades for a specific purpose.
                          I got the saw blade back inside of a week, but I have not been able to use it until last night. I cut some pieces of maple for a project that I'm working on, and holy cow! Not only did this cut easily, but the edges were so smooth, I would almost say they were glue ready! This is way better than the saw would cut brand new. I'll try to get pictures of the edges....
                          Not bad for $12.45.
                          I thought I was going to have to spend $50 on a new saw blade.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                            I have done several jobs with laminate flooring. The coating really dulls the best of carbide blades. No, you can not successfully sharpen the blades yourself. The next time you do a laminate job, use the cheapest carbide blade you can find. The flooring is so thin that just about any blade will cut it all right. Since the edges of the flooring will be ultimately covered up, a little tearout won't show. When you are done, you can throw the blade away.
                            Joe Spear

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Help! My saw won't cut.

                              Originally posted by Joe Spear View Post
                              I have done several jobs with laminate flooring. The coating really dulls the best of carbide blades. No, you can not successfully sharpen the blades yourself. The next time you do a laminate job, use the cheapest carbide blade you can find. The flooring is so thin that just about any blade will cut it all right. Since the edges of the flooring will be ultimately covered up, a little tearout won't show. When you are done, you can throw the blade away.



                              I have to agree!

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