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ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

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  • #16
    Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

    Originally posted by RoyBullets View Post
    cpw - If you take a look a PapaDan's second photo on his link that shows the opening on the TS2400 it is completely open. My TS2410 is not like that but I will post a photo this evening to show what I mean.
    No photo required. To quote the Rocket "I mis-remembered it".

    It looks like I could rabbet the ends and make one pass with a 3/4" straight bit on the side and provide the clearance. Thanks for making me go revisit this.

    Now for the stock I got tired of of over thinking this so I have taken my scrap 3/8" ply and glued 1/8" hard board to the top. I make 2 of these and will let them dry overnight and take them to the router table tomorrow. I probably only need to take 1/16 to 1/8 off the edges I mentioned above. If it does not work well no great loss since it was all scrap.

    Thanks for the help.

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    • #17
      Completed ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

      Ok here are a few photos of the completed ZCI. I need to fine tune my process but for the most part it worked as I planned. The only thing that did not work was the rabbet around the bottom. I needed a wider rabbet bit to catch all the high spots in the hole so I ended up just milling the whole bottom instead.

      Not sure how well the tempered hardboard will hold up, but I use it for my router table jigs, etc. and it seems pretty durable, hard and smooth. I can always wax it a little if needed for small scratches.

      My goal was to make these out of scrap material in the garage so mission accomplished. I had some great birch plywood scraps but the grain was going the wrong way so I just used some 3/8" sanded one side junk I had left over. I will make a couple more for spares but when I run out of plywood I might just get a solid board and either laminate hard board on it or just use it as is. The thing I do like about plywood and gluing it together is that it will not warp or expand / shrink. I have used this technique building poker tables and I can make even the most warped boards flat and stable.

      Thanks for all the help.
      Attached Files

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      • #18
        Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

        Looks like you did indeed accomplish your mission.

        and you sure can beat the price, that's for sure $0.00 !

        What's next, the sled?


        Thanks for posting the pics !

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

          Originally posted by Davet View Post
          Looks like you did indeed accomplish your mission.

          and you sure can beat the price, that's for sure $0.00 !

          What's next, the sled?


          Thanks for posting the pics !
          Thanks. I glued up 6 more and will knock them out tomorrow. Figured I might as well while in the mode and use up most of the scrap.

          Actually I was going to pick up a sheet of MDF or good plywood tomorrow as well as a new blade and start the sled planning. I need one for the TS and one for the router table.

          I tend to over think these things though so I am slow. My wife is trying to figure out why I need a sled in Houston

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

            Originally posted by RoyBullets View Post
            Thanks. I glued up 6 more and will knock them out tomorrow. Figured I might as well while in the mode and use up most of the scrap.

            Actually I was going to pick up a sheet of MDF or good plywood tomorrow as well as a new blade and start the sled planning. I need one for the TS and one for the router table.

            I tend to over think these things though so I am slow. My wife is trying to figure out why I need a sled in Houston
            My sled is as simple as it gets. A $6 1/2 MDF handypanel (2'x4'), with a scrap bit of 3/4 plywood glued/screwed to the bottom, and a scrap pine 1x4 for a reference edge in the back. I used a framing square to get the back edge aligned with the blade, screwed it down, tested it with the five cut method and then tweaked it just slightly. Another test and was good to go. The finished width is about 2'x3.25'. It is solidly on the table, and long/deep enough to provide good support.

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            • #21
              Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

              Originally posted by RoyBullets View Post
              Thanks. I glued up 6 more and will knock them out tomorrow. Figured I might as well while in the mode and use up most of the scrap. ..Way to go!....

              Actually I was going to pick up a sheet of MDF or good plywood tomorrow as well as a new blade and start the sled planning. I need one for the TS and one for the router table. Watch that MDF.. pickup a good dust mask, MDF can be hard on the lungs.

              I tend to over think these things though so I am slow. My wife is trying to figure out why I need a sled in Houston
              Tell her the sled is for the dog sled team, dogs you ordered last week ..
              and start singing North To Alaska, ...Keep em guessing Roy, ...Keep em guessing .
              Thanks for sharing that gave me a real chuckle!
              Last edited by Davet; 08-09-2008, 10:55 PM.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                Originally posted by cpw View Post
                My sled is as simple as it gets. A $6 1/2 MDF handypanel (2'x4'), with a scrap bit of 3/4 plywood glued/screwed to the bottom, and a scrap pine 1x4 for a reference edge in the back. I used a framing square to get the back edge aligned with the blade, screwed it down, tested it with the five cut method and then tweaked it just slightly. Another test and was good to go. The finished width is about 2'x3.25'. It is solidly on the table, and long/deep enough to provide good support.
                That sounds about like my speed for my first one. I aspire to something like DaveT's but like my router table I am going to make something modest first until I figure out what I need.

                Is the 3/4 plywood you put on the bottom for the miter track or do you have a double thickness sled? Also what is the 5 cut method? I will search for that one.

                Thanks!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                  I followed one of the suggestions in this thread and made myself a nice ZCI of a scrap of laminate flooring board (LFB). Nice, except for the screw part. That's what happens when you measure incorrectly (see picture). The insert feels stronger and has less flex than the stock one that comes with the saw. They are also very slick with less friction than the table itself.

                  One thing I found out is that the LFB will bend with the laminated surface up. This must have to do with the surface tension of the laminate, as opposed to that of the underside. The LFB I used is a cheap variety, 8mm thick. Two of those yield just over 5/8".

                  Since the support for the insert in Ridgid saws is only partial (not along the entire opening) gluing the boards' undersides I decided to rout off only what is needed for the insert to be flush with the table top. This allows for the new ZCI to be very rigid and for the two board warped in the opposite directions to counter each other. The result being flat and straight surface.

                  To allow better glue penetration I scored the undersides of the boards generously by running the pieces on the TS every 1/4 and 1/64" deep.

                  Pictures below show the amount of warping before the boards were glued together.
                  Attached Files
                  In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                    Originally posted by RoyBullets View Post
                    Is the 3/4 plywood you put on the bottom for the miter track or do you have a double thickness sled?
                    Yep, a 3/4 board didn't run as nicely as the 23/32 plywood.

                    Originally posted by RoyBullets View Post
                    Also what is the 5 cut method? I will search for that one.

                    Thanks!
                    Take a scrap piece, and cut a 90* in it. Then turn it 90*, and cut another 90, referencing off the face that you just cut. Repeat this 3 more times, for a total of 5 cuts. Any error in your alignment will be magnified 4 times, so it is easier to tell if your sled is really giving you a square cut.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                      Originally posted by darius View Post
                      I followed one of the suggestions in this thread and made myself a nice ZCI of a scrap of laminate flooring board (LFB). Nice, except for the screw part. That's what happens when you measure incorrectly (see picture). The insert feels stronger and has less flex than the stock one that comes with the saw. They are also very slick with less friction than the table itself.

                      One thing I found out is that the LFB will bend with the laminated surface up. This must have to do with the surface tension of the laminate, as opposed to that of the underside. The LFB I used is a cheap variety, 8mm thick. Two of those yield just over 5/8".

                      Since the support for the insert in Ridgid saws is only partial (not along the entire opening) gluing the boards' undersides I decided to rout off only what is needed for the insert to be flush with the table top. This allows for the new ZCI to be very rigid and for the two board warped in the opposite directions to counter each other. The result being flat and straight surface.

                      To allow better glue penetration I scored the undersides of the boards generously by running the pieces on the TS every 1/4 and 1/64" deep.

                      Pictures below show the amount of warping before the boards were glued together.
                      I just could not find the laminate flooring boards or I would have used some of those. Gluing the plywood and hardboard worked for me.

                      The ply I had was a little warped but after gluing and clamping I now have 8 inserts. I used the roughest side of the ply and of course the rough side of the hardboard for the best adhesion.

                      Thanks for the pics. If I ever need more I am going to hunt down some of that flooring.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                        Originally posted by cpw View Post
                        Yep, a 3/4 board didn't run as nicely as the 23/32 plywood.
                        Thank makes sense. I have tested a few different widths scraps to see how that will work in the track.

                        Originally posted by cpw View Post
                        Take a scrap piece, and cut a 90* in it. Then turn it 90*, and cut another 90, referencing off the face that you just cut. Repeat this 3 more times, for a total of 5 cuts. Any error in your alignment will be magnified 4 times, so it is easier to tell if your sled is really giving you a square cut.
                        Great test! Thanks

                        I picked up a 4x8 piece of 1/2 MDF today. I have a couple of fixtures to build so I will begin laying them out this week.

                        Thanks for sharing the tips.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                          Originally posted by RoyBullets View Post
                          I just could not find the laminate flooring boards or I would have used some of those. Gluing the plywood and hardboard worked for me.
                          I didn't mean to suggest that laminate is better. The fact is that I didn't have any ply to spare for the purpose and it seemed that the idea was to see what would work. It still remains to be seen how the whole thing will survive the garage environment and moisture in the air.

                          I have about 200 s/f of spare laminate flooring so perhaps I should quit my day job and sell the inserts, after I figure out how to drill screw holes properly that is

                          Btw. you might want o visit one of the flooring stores and ask for a sample to make sure it will match your "existing kitchen floor" (wink, wink). All you really need is a single board.

                          One more note.
                          Some complained the blade doesn't go down enough for the initial cut of the ZCI. I used a 7 1/4" blade for that cut. Just make sure the kerf size is the same, or a hair larger than that of the 10" blade
                          Last edited by darius; 08-10-2008, 10:21 PM.
                          In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                            I actually looked for a while on Thursday to find some. It seems I have to buy a whole box. If it is like the Pergo I looked at, that stuff is idestructrable and I bet it will out last my hard board.

                            At $25 a pop, I bet you could make some money The first 2 I made took a couple of hours but the next 6 took about 15 minutes a piece.

                            I messed up one hole as well but just drilled it out bigger with no problems. Also I found if I put a little masking tape around th edges they fit very snug.

                            Good luck and good job. I have already found the benefits of using the ZCIs. Now I am trying to figure our how to do the same thing for my router table.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                              My board also took about 2 hours.

                              I did some woodworking in the past, but that was house construction where 1/8" of tolerance was acceptable. I'm am not a pro by any stretch of imagination so I was learning as I went and I hit a few snags, as well as shortage of correct router bits.

                              1. The kind and amount of double sided tape I used was excessive so I had to use a flat pry bar and quite a bit of force to separate the laminate from the Ridgid insert.

                              2. I had route the top rounded edge freehand, just above the lip which holds the insert at the back of the opening. I just have no idea how to go about it otherwise. Perhaps I should have dealt with the lip (on one of the boards) before gluing the boards together.
                              In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: ZCI Stock for TS2410LS

                                Originally posted by darius View Post
                                2. I had route the top rounded edge freehand, just above the lip which holds the insert at the back of the opening. I just have no idea how to go about it otherwise. Perhaps I should have dealt with the lip (on one of the boards) before gluing the boards together.
                                Better too much tape than not enough. I did this as well but recovered.

                                It sounds like you did not use a flush trim bit with a bearing? These are awesome if you have not used one before.

                                I buy my bits from MLCS. I used the 1/2" bit listed here.

                                http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shops.../bt_flush.html

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