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  • I need help with adhesives

    form these adhesives: Alphatic, cellulose, cyanoacrylate, epoxy, polyvinyl acetate, resorcinol, urea formaldehyde. I keed the common names, uese, characteristics,solvent for clean up. thanks

    [ 07-18-2002, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: Andy B. ]
    Andy B.

  • #2
    I only know some off the top of my head:

    cyanoacrylate: "superglue"; fast bond, low shock resistance, low-medium strength, (really) high price; acetone (I think?). Special note, one of the uses for cyanoacrylates is in suture-free surgery. This stuff will glue your hands together like nothing else.

    epoxy: "epoxy", "two-part epoxy", slow, adjustable set time, enormous water resistance, thick, some gap-filling properties (not as much as many think though), medium strength. If the stock's surface is burnished, strength falls to low. Cleanup, don't get it on you mostly, I think acetone will solve it if not set up. UV light damages epoxy, so care must be taken in outdoor applications. Epoxy is the only adhesive I'm aware of that also is used as a finish, some bar-top material is epoxy.

    polyvinyl acetate: "PVA", "white glue", "yellow glue". This is the common woodworker's glue. Fairly fast setting (yellow is faster than white), poor water resistance (there are water resistant versions available, such as Titebond II), very strong bond, stronger than wood itself. Doesn't bond to non-porous materials well, this is a poor choice to stick metal to wood, for example. Cleanup is with water.

    Those are the ones I know pretty well. I'm fairly sure you have a duplicate, I think Aliphatic glue and PVA is the same stuff. Not positive, however.

    For the ones I only know a little about:

    I think cellulose glues are fairly obsolete. I seem to recall that they are not long-lasting.

    Resorcinol glues are used in boat-building because they are waterproof. IIRC, they have a purple color that limits them in furniture applications.

    Urea Formaldehyde I believe is used in veneer glueups. UniBond 800 is the only brand I'm familiar with.

    Dave

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    • #3
      thanks dave!!!!!
      Andy B.

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      • #4
        You're welcome, Andy. If you don't mind my asking, what brought it up?

        Oh, I meant to mention in my first post that there is a glaring omission in your list, animal glue is missing. Generally called hide glue, it's strong suits are fixability after huge numbers of years have passed, and lack of creep. Weak point is that most have to be heated to use, and they don't exactly smell "fresh as a daisy". Cleanup is with water.

        Dave

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        • #5
          4-h woodworking book
          Andy B.

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          • #6
            [img]smile.gif[/img] You get an A+ Dave... Good info...
            Regards,<br /><br />Big Johnson<br /><br />Pictures: <a href=\"http://www.woodworkersweb.com/modules.php?set_albumName=albuv85&op=modload&name= gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php\" target=\"_blank\">http://www.woodworkersweb.com/modules.php?set_albumName=albuv85&op=modload&name= gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php</a>

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            • #7
              As long as we're on this topic, Dave mentioned a situation I find myself closing in on, that is bonding wood to metal. I'm finishing work on a pair of Titanic Deck Chairs, and am considering using Gorilla Glue to bond the male portion of the pivot hinges into the rails. Is this a good choice of glue, or is there something better for this purpose? Thanks in advance for any assistance!

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              • #8
                Thanks, Andy. Sounds cool.

                John, I would use epoxy, but have no experience with polyurethane glues at all. I'm a little prejudiced against them, just based on stories told by friends.

                Which is why it didn't occur to me to mention them to Andy as another item missing from the list.

                Dave

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                • #9
                  Mr. Arbuckle,

                  With these glues what about safety precautions?
                  Andy B.

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                  • #10
                    Mr. Arbuckle,

                    With these glues what about safety precautions?
                    Andy B.

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                    • #11
                      Wow! I feel like we had this conversation just a year ago!

                      I'm not comfortable giving out advice on chemical safety. It is quite easy to get MSDS (material safety data sheet) information from any manufacturer of products such as these, they often are available on-line. Find the web site of a manufacturer and see if either they have a search function (searching for MSDS), or a link from their product page. For example, the Titebond company web site, http://www.titebond.com , has a link directly on the front page for MSDS.

                      MSDS tend to run long, they are government mandated information. But, if you're patient and slog through them, they generally make sense and lay out all the factors involved in the product's potential dangers.

                      Sorry to not be more direct, hope you understand. And please, I'm Dave. [img]smile.gif[/img]

                      Dave

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                      • #12
                        Thanks Dave!
                        Andy B.

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                        • #13
                          gorilla glue, or elmers poly glue are very strong and very effective. as they dry they expand and they "ooze" out looking like a honeycomb

                          when using these glues make sure you have access to scrape off the access on all sides. i learned this lesson while building a shadow box for a fellow military man who retired. glued the glass in on the face and then glued some other items, the gorilla glue oozed out between the glass and the project. i ended up having to get the glass "etched" in order to hide this mistake. i would have disassembled and rebuilt but i was out of time

                          i guess long story short...dont use gorilla glue on items where you will not have access to one or more sides once glued

                          ed
                          \"A SHIP OF WAR IS THE BEST AMBASSADOR\"<br /><br />OLIVER CROMWELL

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Dave Arbuckle:

                            John, I would use epoxy, but have no experience with polyurethane glues at all. I'm a little prejudiced against them, just based on stories told by friends.
                            Dave,
                            Could you relate some of the reasons you've heard for not using polyurethane glues?

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                            • #15
                              Stuart, look at Ed's commentary just above yours... Glue that oozes out, why would I want that?

                              I've seen a couple disasters caused where the foaming has pushed joints apart. The good news in such circumstance is that the foam has essentially no strength at all, so the ruined joint can often be cut or wrenched apart relatively easily. If it is something like a mortise and tenon though, forget it, the parts are most likely ruined.

                              If it gets on your hands (uncured), it stains them. The makers of Gorilla Glue say there is no known product that will take the stains off.

                              To top it all off, the product is extremely expensive and has a very limited shelf life once the bottle's been opened.

                              If I really needed an ANSI Type I waterproof glue, I would consider the stuff. No one yet has provided me a reason to use water activated polyurethane glue for furniture.

                              Dave

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