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Ridgid 3650 v. Craftsman 22114 / 22124

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  • Ridgid 3650 v. Craftsman 22114 / 22124

    I'm a newbie in the market for my 1st TS (actually my 2nd -- I bought and then promptly returned a junky $179 craftsman after cutting 2 boards). I'm struggling between the 3650 and 22114 (and maybe the 22124). My garage space is limited, so I was planning to go with the 3650. However, I've read about the arbor problem and leg issues and am now re-thing. I'm also uncertain on the fence. Although the 3650 gets positive reviews, it seems too plastico -- like the one on the craftsman I returned. My HD guy says he's had a few broken fence handles. The right rip capacity on the 3650 appears better than the 22114 and 22124, but I'm not sure if that makes a big difference -- I'm told I should be ripping sheets of ply with the circular saw. I'd be most appreciative if you cabinet makers could lend some additional insight. I want a saw I can grow into, and only want to buy one. Lots of people say I should get a Delta or Jet and stay away from Ridgid and craftsman. Thanks.

  • #2
    While I'm not an ultra patriot I don’t think it is wise to feed communist China's economy. That is exactly where the Sears machine is made. Also everyone is trumpeting about Orion Customer Service. My question to them is how long do you think that will last? The machine is labeled Sears, Sears not Orion is responsible for the Customer Service. No other company that manufactures for Sears and has their product labeled Sears has anything to do with the product. Now if the product is made by another company and is labeled by that company and sold by Sears, yes they stay involved. But in this case Orion is small company that is trying to get started so they are staying involved until this thing gets going but I doubt it will be much longer.

    I also have mentioned the many shortcomings of the Ridgid machine. To me the worst is the leg issue. I think the arbor issue is a problem but no where near the scale some people make it to be. First it only shows up when using dado blades which isn’t all that often. Second it makes the bottom of the dado less than perfectly flat. Something very few dado sets do to begin with. And with the exception of being able to see this on exposed dado’s it has very little effect.

    The legs to me are another issue. I think they reveal cost cuts that shouldn’t have been made. And make me hold the rest of the machine as suspect.

    That said there are things you need to consider. First a contractor saw has an extra 8” – 12” of depth because of the motor placement. In tight places this could be a problem. On contractor saws the dust collection needs add-ons to be effective.

    You mentioned rip capacity. Personally I look at it this way if I can rip past halfway in the 4X8 I can rip the plywood to dimension. Therefore anything larger than 24” is enough for me. However your right using a guide saw system and circular saw is far safer and much easier than trying to throw 4x8 sheets around.

    What I think matters most are things like ease of blade guards removal and reinstall, location of controls, and bottom line price. People will talk about trunnion location, motor horse power and truthfully that is exactly what it is talk. Sure cabinet mounted trunnions are easier to adjust but on most saws this adjustment is made once. Table mounted trunnions actually have less chance of moving than cabinet mount where movement in the cabinet can actually effect the relationship between the table and the trunnions. But it is nothing to worry about in either case.

    Others will go on about horsepower, 3 horsepower is nice but 5 is better and 10 better still. Where does it stop? It is my personal belief that if your going to use power feed you need at least 3 hp. However if your never going to use power feeders then you need enough horsepower to power the blade through the wood. 1 ½ horsepower has been doing this for years.

    Delta has a nice track record but some of their machines are being made in China. Jet seems fine, as does General that often earns first place in test reviews. Let’s face the facts the average home hobbyist will never wear out any one of the machines sold today. I know many commercial shops that use Delta, Jet, Grizzly, Shop Fox, General contractor saws, ripping thousands of board feet a month and they run and run and run.
    Rev Ed

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    • #3
      Most contractor style saws have good and bad points but overall almost all are acceptable. The June/July issue of WOOD Magazine reviews and rates 11 different contractor style TS's. I'd suggest you buy a copy of this magazine and become more familiar with all the different saws that are available out there and then decide whats best for you.
      I decided to change calling the bathroom the "John" and renamed it the "Jim". I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.

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      • #4
        Had ts3650, have 22124, I am so happy now.
        On a previous post I explained how I tried my best to work around the problems with my 3650 ,but gave up when the arbor issue came to light. I just had had it with all the "fixes". I also think since I bought the first run of this saw it may have had QC issues, since it was top rated in Wood Mag. for it's price range, the problems I had, may not exist now. I do question how the Ridgid has better cutting speed than the 2hp /20A saws? Motor power wired at 240v was never an issue on my saw, it was good.
        The Beis fence is well worth the $. The plastic lock/aluminum consrtuction on the Ridgid compared to the commercial Beis is just no contest,cab base,Leitz blade(as good as $100 WW forrest)etc. About $750 when on sale and CC discounts.
        See this link:

        http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthr...lapsed&sb=5&o=

        [ 05-15-2005, 09:38 AM: Message edited by: Andrew Benedetto ]

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        • #5
          IMO the 3650 and 22114 are nip and tuck for features and value. Pick which features are most important to you, or best price.

          If you can get a 22124 into your price range, there's no longer any decisions to make IMHO...I've heard of it going as low as $564...it's rare but does happen. The 22124 has many of the advantages of the 22114, plus several more. The comments have been extremely positive, the performance is excellent, and the features are likely to be the trend of the future....cabinet mounted trunnions, fully enclosed cabinet, good blade, outstanding fence...

          So far Orion and Sears have put together an impressive effort on the 22124.

          [ 05-14-2005, 09:47 PM: Message edited by: hewood ]

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          • #6
            Isn't the Ridgid saw made in China also?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Ray Dockrey:
              Isn't the Ridgid saw made in China also?
              I've heard the motor is made in China, but not sure about the saw. Saws some with several parts that can come from a variety of origins and it can be hard to track all of them. Motors, leg stands, belts, fences, miter gauges, wings, mobile bases, inserts, wrenches, blades, etc.

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              • #8
                In fact, one of my original objections to the 3650 was ALL the motor said was "Made in China"---not even a company name.

                I think if you're going to start eliminating things made in China from your posessions, you'll have a hard time-----at least I've found it to be that way.

                I think the Sears saw represents a 180 degree turn for their tool quality. The features I like include the Biese' fence, as well as trunions like a cabinet saw. That was one reason I never considered some of the original hybrids, was that they all had contractor saw trunions. Having spent my share of time bent up like a prettzle, my next saw will have those trunions---if I don't opt for a cabinet saw.
                Dave

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                • #9
                  dave, what does being bent up like a pretzel have to do with trunnions? I think I may be missing something.
                  www.TheWoodCellar.com

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                  • #10
                    Rafael---well, front trunion bolts aren't the easiest to reach, and until I learned how to fix mine, it was a regular event.
                    Dave

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by daveferg:
                      I think if you're going to start eliminating things made in China from your posessions, you'll have a hard time-----at least I've found it to be that way.
                      Dave
                      I think we need to watch for where things are made. At one time “Made in China” really meant Taiwan, however recently it actually means Communist China. I personally can not make any sense out dealing with people that want to destroy us. In effect we are giving them the means to accomplish their desire and to me that seems stupid on our part. Many somehow think saving a buck is more important than peace of mind, either that or they mistakenly believe China isn’t a threat.

                      I don’t know where the motor on the Ridgid is made, the Wood Magazine listed country of origin for the 3650 as Taiwan a friend to the US. Your right it is getting harder and harder to avoid buying things in the China and that should scare the willies out of us. However I think we should try to the very best of our ability to do just that, avoid sending our money to that nation.

                      As you know I'm not a big Ridgid supporter however if I had to make a choice between Ridgid and Sears I would go with Ridgid. But I would hope I my choices might include one of the other saws that are made either here in the US or some friendly country.
                      Rev Ed

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                      • #12
                        I purchased the TS3650 last summer but after looking at the Sears 22114 and trying a friends, I took the 3650 back. I don't have a lot of room and wanted better dust collection. The 22114 is much better to move around with out the motor hanging out the back and the dust collection is as different as night and day. I do think that I liked the 3650 rip fence better. They both lock down and are solid but the 3650 fence is much lighter and made it easier to slide on the table and take of (just a weight issue). Also the 3650 fence locked at the back and front, this plus the motor in the back made it very troublesome to attach an out feed table. The 22114 has none of those problems. The 3650 out of the box has longer rip capabilities but it not much trouble to slide over the 22114 rails to surpass the 3650. I paid (last year) $500 dollars for the 3650. It now is pushing $600 dollars. I just picked up the 22114 for $414 and you just can’t beat it for the price. The hurclulift was a nice feature but my garage floor has a few low spots in the area that I used the saw and the lift would just barely clear those spots. Worked well but needed just a bit more elevation travel for me. If rip capacity is an issue, you can slide the 22114 rails over giving you about 36 inches. Add a new stick on tape and your doing great. Hope this helps. I would really take a second look at the 22114 first. Not a long track record but so far so good. As for being made in China, I realy couldn't care. I feel that its our own unions that are damaging us. China is just taking advantage of the issue. We would do the same. I care about my pocket book. Not so much ware it is made.

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                        • #13
                          Thank you to everyone for your insight. I'm going to do a little more reasearch and come to a decision in the next month or so. Right now, I'm leaning toward the 22114. I'm a little gun-shy on the 3650 in light of the several concerns which consistently appear throughout this site. At the same time, I hate spending my money at Sears.

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                          • #14
                            I am looking to buy the 22114 but can't find it any lower than $599. What am I missing here. How did you pick up one $414.

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                            • #15
                              $414 is the lowest I've heard of the 22114 going for and will be very difficult to duplicate. $540 is not hard to do. $414 must have required incredible timing and some luck and/or negotiating skills.

                              I can't speak for Randy, but I got my 22124 for $594 during a 4 hour 20% off sale ($760). That sale overlapped with the Craftsman Club days which was knocking $100 off the sale price of $899 ($799). The clerk gave me the $100 CMan Club discount on top of the 4 hour sale price. In addition I was carrying a 10% e-mail coupon you can get for signing up to receive their email flyers....free delivery iced the deal for me. I think Randy got his saw around the same time I did (4/23), and suspect he got similar discounts....I don't know if they were intended to work out that way, but to my amazement they did that day!

                              At the very least, sign up for the Cman Club...it's free and has been valuable for me.

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