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  • Moving Forward

    As you all know, I have plans to add onto, and upgrade in the future to my shop. With current events concerning Ridgid, I doubt we will see improvements beyond the entry level for machinery. So I have been doing lots of research.

    Some common names above the entry level are Jet, Grizzly, Delta, PowerMatic, General, and spinoff names. But one name that is often over looked, stands proud in the few machines they make. They don't offer a complete line, but what they do offer, is revolutionary to today's woodworker.

    So for those looking for a little more than entry level machines, don't pass up the possability of Shop Fox I feel it's a worth while time to look at, and I'm sure you will all see the name in my shop in the future.
    John E. Adams<br /><a href=\"\" target=\"_blank\"></a>

  • #2
    For TRUE customer support, you can't do much better than any line of tools from the WMH Tool Group.
    I have one of there Drill Presses from there Canadian line (Mastercraft). I bought it second hand, was missing the chuck key and manual, gave them a call to order this stuff and was sent it at no cost. That's customer support.
    There brands include Jet, Powermatic,Mastercraft,Preformax, and Wilton, amoung others.
    I just have a feeling the Ridgid line of woodworking tools is dead and gone. The stuff happening at HD is for a reason. They must be clearing out there stock.
    Maybe I should re-think the TP1300. Maybe moveing up to a Jet is the way to go.Many more $$$, but there not going anywhere.
    Rob Johnson
    Just tilt your head a little and it will look straight!


    • #3
      My next TP purchase:
      20" Thickness Planer

      And can't beat this for a mortiser deal:
      Dual post mortiser

      [ 06-29-2003, 09:18 PM: Message edited by: UO_Woody ]
      John E. Adams<br /><a href=\"\" target=\"_blank\"></a>


      • #4
        Woody -

        Check your e-mail. I just forwarded an e-mail I got from Curt at Wilke with four attached photos comparing the innards of the PM66 to the Bridgewood cabinet saw. I think you will want to add Bridgewood to your list of companies to consider.



        • #5
          I bought the Shop Fox benchtop drill press recently from a local woodworking supply/equipment store (see my post "Is this guy right?".

          I had two problems with the drill press during assembly; the belt cover was slightly damaged in the rear corner which caused it not to close properly and this drill press is the oscillating kind for sanding which requires a small belt added to two of the belt pulleys. When I tried the spindle sander it worked fine but when I went to remove the small pulley it had broken.

          I got on the phone with Shop Fox and they were excellent. I just received a new cover and small belt for the oscillating sander.

          Having never owned a drill press before I can't really give any advice as to how it has performed. I chose it because it had a larger motor (3/4 hp), larger chuck size (up to 5/8) and the oscillating sander. It seems that it will do the job for the kind of ww I plan on doing.



          • #6
            WMH Group makes good tools - I just bought a couple. I chose the Jet Band Saw because it was highly recommended. It works as advertised. Up to specs. But no excitement. Terrible dust collection. I now wish I had taken the chance on a Grizzly for several hundred dollars less, and several features more. (I keep hearing people consider Grizzly "taking a chance" but I have never heard anyone disappointed.)

            I find it amazing that Woodstock International, the ShopPro people, have three distribution centers in the same locations as the three Grizzly distribution centers. And unusual that Grizzly sells Shop Pro equipment along side the almost identical Grizzly brands. Have you figured that out?

            A while back Sears sued Emerson for playing dirty with their divorce, and wanted an injunction to keep Emerson from selling some of the equipment that Sears claim were made with Sears design and tools. Now Emerson is getting out of the woodworking equipment manufacturing. Are the two events related? I'm glad I got the Ridgid tools I do, I'm not worried about support (because I probably won't need it), but I doubt if I will be able to buy other Ridgid woodworking tools in a few months.


            • #7
              The problem for me is that these "niche player" guys can't seem to get a product to California, or other "remote" locations.

              Wilke? Forget it. They have sewn up a good line in Bridgewood... all you have to do is pay your own motor freight to CA from PA... and hire a forklift to get it off the truck. I could buy a cabinet saw locally, when you net this out.

              General? Not for sale... not around here, at least, and they have failed to respond to two e-mails on where or how I could buy their product. If this is any indication of the support I can expect after the sale (assuming I could find out how to consummate one in the first place), no way.

              Shop Fox is dealer-only, and doesn't bother including a dealer locator. You can call 'em to find a product, hopefully in the same time zone. It is ridiculous not to be able to find a product from a web site, and I'm tired of hide-and-seek info that ought to be one click away. They don't seem to offer a contractor's saw, anyway. No list prices, either... used car, anyone?

              Grizzly is probably the best of the bunch, for internet marketing, but the freight is still a killer. Motor freight on a contractor's saw over 2000 miles makes it one of the highest priced choices on the list for left coasters, even though it's positioned as a "value leader". No deal.

              Of all of these, I was most disappointed in General. It's unbelievable that they can't answer one (much less two) e-mails in two weeks time (about how to buy their friggin' product!). Even Ridgid tells us every couple weeks that they can't tell us anything. General just doesn't tell you anything.

              For a mid-range new TS, ya may as well bite the bullet and go to Sears or Lowe's and buy the big markup from somewhere that will still be in business three years from now. When the smoke clears, you can at least drive over and pick up a tool you can see, and get a part or an answer (however lame) from a human, rather than e-mailing into the void and paying some trucker's diesel bill across the fruited plains.

              Too bad HD has taken themselves out of the running but that's life in the free market.

              If only Emerson would hook up with Big Lots....


              • #8
                My next TS will be a PM64 or 66. I have yet to see any saw that tops either one in it's class. I am going to keep the Ridgid saws I have for now...especially the 2400...not a better jobsite saw out there.

                I think Ridgid is dead in the water. I doubt we'll ever see another Ridgid WW tool anywhere...sounds like the Sears lawsuit might have been the deal killer.
                Kelly C. Hanna<br /><a href=\"\" target=\"_blank\">Hanna Woodworks</a>


                • #9

                  FWIW, Shop Fox tools are really just Grizzly tools with maybe one or two add-ons and white paint that have a higher price tag because they are sold by second paarties other than Grizzly. If you don't already have their catalog, I suggest you call them on it. I think it's about 400 pages and packed full of about everything you could ever want.


                  • #10
                    Charlie P -

                    It is not suprising that ShopFox, Woodstock and Grizzly are all sold at the same location. They are all owned by the same person. ShopFox is an upgraded Grizzly to be sold by independant dealers who wish to carry the line. They will, at some point, be available around the country.



                    • #11
                      No question Shop Fox is Grizly in another paint job----as to being upgraded---well, that remains to be seen---unless you're lucky enough to compare them side by side, which is a little hard to do unless you're near a Griz' center.

                      I'm a little surprised at lack of response from General. They always impressed me as a class product.

                      Personally, while you hope you never need it, customer service is a major part of my tool selection. From my own experiences and what I've read----Delta is tops with Jet/PM a close second. Indeed, Delta's CS is so good, if you buy a used Delta, they'll give you excellent information and parts availibility.

                      I would say that you can't simply make brand your only decission. Just depends on the tool.


                      • #12
                        Mark IV

                        You need to check Grizzly again. Contractor saw similar to 2424 for $449 and fixed shipping in lower 48 of $75, and no sales tax. 3 HP Cabinet saw $895 + 75 shpping. I have never had a trucker that didn't help unload, even though they are only required to get it to the tailgate. But you can also pick it up at the truck depot, similar to pick up at the local store.


                        • #13
                          Mark IV, you don't say where in California you are, it's a lonnnng state. General dealers in California are:

                          C.B. Tool & Supply
                          90 Karina Court
                          San Jose, CA 95131
                          800-662-9858 - 408-436-5515 - Fax 408-436-0707

                          Eagle Tools
                          2217 EL SOL ave
                          Atadena,CA 91001
                          626-797-8262 - Fax 626-797-8271

                          Peninsula Power Tool
                          828 Lighthouse Ave
                          Monterey, CA 93940
                          831-375-4244 - Fax 831-375-2655

                          Sacramento Machinery Co.
                          729 West Del Paso Road
                          Sacramento, CA 95834
                          800-762-9663 - 916-568-7514 - Fax 916-568-6022

                          Santa Rosa Tool & Supply
                          1651 Piner Road
                          Santa Rosa, CA 95403
                          800-464-8665 - 707-545-6480 - Fax 707-545-3705

                          Certainly better if you're in Northern than Southern. Unless you're in an unusual location, you probably have a General dealer closer than my closest. Weird, ain't it?

                          You might get a better response from them if you write in French.



                          • #14
                            I'm surprised at the responses!

                            I just wanted to make a statement because even before I decided on Ridgid, I looked at all the above names in machinery. I spent 3 months, at least 2 to 3 hours nightly researching machinery. Shop Fox was overlooked then because info was few and far between. I think it's moot to look forward to upgrades in Rigid's line like I had hoped for.

                            Also, as most of you know, I am not very fond of the color green. That's not to say I wouldn't buy a green colored machine because I will eventually have the general mortiser with tilting head. It's the only one to my knowledge that has a tilting head.

                            I would not buy a Shop Fox Band Saw. I'm keeping my eye on the Laguna line for a larger Band Saw. I feel the table top mortiser Shop Fox offers is about as good as you can get, at any price. And I say this because I touchy feelied it with the ones next to it: the Fisch, General and Jet models at the local WW store.

                            Shop Fox is often over looked as a possability. It's reputation is building...slowly. Ridgid did not sell their machines, neither does Shop Fox. Yet they stand behind them as well as Ridgid did.

                            I'm looking long term investments, and not in the emmidate future, so I'm looking at everything, gathering all the info I can. Like I said, they are worth a consideration when in the market for a machine in the size and price range your looking for. My local WW store will order it in without added shipping. They are one of the dealers.

                            I am faulting no brands (other than for color ), or favoring none. Just looking at facts I can find. I'm quite impressed with what I've found on the 20" planer, at a comperable price for the Jet 15" model.

                            I appreciate the Email forwarded. If I read the dates correctly, they responded in 3 days. Wilkes was highly recommended by a long distance friend when I approached him for advice when I began my search for machinery.

                            And like I have always said; shipping, to receive, or warrenty repairs, was a major factor in selecting Ridgid. Down time was a trip to HD 1/2 hour away, and setting up a new machine. Not weeks/months accross country in hopes the replacement arrived without damage.

                            I currently own several tools and accessories under the Woodstock name. Pleased with the quality for the price I paid.

                            I built a shop in a summer, stocked it with machines and tools. Enough to do most anything. It's not all top end stuff. But the tool is only as good as the operator. It's just a chance for us to put things in our shop to do the things we would like to do, build our skills and get us underway with enjoying woodworking at an affordable price. I see nothing at fault with that, nor anyone that can afford to go out and do the same as I did and buy the best most expensive tools and machines.

                            Feedback is always welcome, and first hand experience from owners of any tools that's willing to comment and opinionize on them will benefit all of us.

                            Thank you for taking your time to post your knowledge and opinions.

                            I'm sure Mark IV is eyeing Dave's info. As usual, Dave seams to have the most knowledge...Thanks Dave. (How do you do that?)
                            John E. Adams<br /><a href=\"\" target=\"_blank\"></a>


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by UO_Woody:
                              I'm sure Mark IV is eyeing Dave's info. As usual, Dave seams to have the most knowledge...Thanks Dave. (How do you do that?)
                              I am, and second your thanks (to Dave). I was crabby.

                              I'm in north San Diego, so the nearest General is in north LA, about 3 hours if all goes well, open two Saturdays a month from 9 to 1. That would have to be a heckuva saw.

                              I have been stalking TS's for over half a year, although I can afford to in terms of woodworking because I haven't really had time to use one anyway. It's just frustrating to zero in on one (3612) after all the research and then have it yanked away, in a manner of speaking.

                              Grizz PROZ (more in the 3612 league, I think)is $675 to the door; the regular Z is $500 special (thanks Charlie)... no Herculift, and I don't think the fence on the 1022Z is the equal of the Ridgid (opinions? This is not the SF, but the Regular 1022Z fence . That's the problem with web sales, you've no idea until it's too late.

                              Something will turn up, sorry I vented here. I am just disappointed at the relative difficulty of seeing something before I buy, and getting a reasonable price and support. It must be my Marketing chromosome... ya wonder what some of these guys could do if they got serious about selling boatloads of saws.

                              Frankly, if Ryobi and/or HD put their marketing efforts behind a Grizz or a General, it would be the biggest selling brand in the States, 'cause people could put their arms around one anywhere and kick the tires (hopefully not at the same time).

                              Thanks, all.